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Author Topic: advice for odd problem  (Read 478 times)

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Offline sabot6d

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advice for odd problem
« on: August 19, 2017, 08:12:53 AM »
Ok Just looking for ideas here.

Im the Varsity DC for the Grand Valley Christian Patriots. We play in a special division for Christian schools. Most of our players come from schools that arent large enough for their own team and quite a few are home schooled as well. Our first game is against a school that is having trouble even fielding a team.  Currently they only have 10 players half of which I understand are freshman.

We agreed to play them 8 man so I need to adjust the D for that.

Our opponent is not a passing team, historically 1 pass per quarter is a lot for them.

My thought is remove the 2 outside stack backers and the Reaper.

3 man front DTs line up on the outside shoulder of the Gs and cover B gap with some contain and fill responsibilities.
Middle stack runs taps on the A gaps.
Dogs line up 3x4 off the EMLOS and hold outside contain and flats coverage.
Corners at normal 8-10 yard depth with inside leverage.

My 2 DTs are monsters and fast so outside runs should not be an issue at all.
Nose and middle stack are both disciplined athletic kids with size
My reaper will move to strength CB and #1CB  will play backside
#2 CB moves to strength Dog
both regular Dogs will rotate through backside Dog

I'm blessed with a lot of kids with speed and smarts for my cover group but I'm still concerned about getting burned deep. Obvious passing downs we can drop the middle stack backer into short middle zone but I dont want to do that often as I hope to bury this young opponent through aggression and brute force. Demoralize them early and then rotate fresh legs in for the remainder.

Advice or suggestions? affirmations or criticisms?

Offline mahonz

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Re: advice for odd problem
« Reply #1 on: August 19, 2017, 10:50:06 AM »
8 man rules say the O must have 5 on the LOS.

I would play it per you own strengths. So I would match the O mathematically and drop the NG and MIKE. Leave the Reaper. Now you can play full taps and fill every interior gap.

Then I would drop one CB and play the other per the O's strength or to the field side.

Now your outside stack's Reaper and Dogs are in tact and play normal. If they are a running team now you have a sound D without too much change.

My take.
Collect moments, not wins.

Offline coacharnold

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Re: advice for odd problem
« Reply #2 on: August 19, 2017, 11:15:06 AM »
Mahonz hit it on the head with the math.  8 man teams usually play with 3 OL and 2 TEs.  The simplest way is to adjust here is to remove the MLB and NG, then play your 2 remaining stacks on the Gs with Spurs setting the edge.  The only thing about this is that it puts you in an Even front and I'm not sure how much you want to do that.

If you want to stay in the Odd look, which might cause more problems for their blocking, then keep the stacks and drop the Spurs, but this could complicate your adjustment rules and put you even deeper into the defense of the week category.

To help keep it simpler for the secondary, I'd yank the FS and play a 3-3-2 or a 2-4-2 with the CBs just aligning based off #1 to each side.  If the FS is one of my best athletes, as he should be IMO, I'd coach him up on how to play corner in the defense of the week and use him there.  Play man out of this.

Offline sabot6d

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Re: advice for odd problem
« Reply #3 on: August 19, 2017, 04:49:30 PM »
So a 2-2 stack with both dogs 1 CB to Strength and the Reaper?

If that is what you are proposing then I understand and already did go over a similar look with the D on Thursday. It wasnt the reaper position, as it was 2 CBs still but weak side did play at full depth 10 yards and much more over the middle.

My experience with 8 man is exactly Zero so its a lot of on the fly adjustments in my thought processes.

Offline coacharnold

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Re: advice for odd problem
« Reply #4 on: August 19, 2017, 05:12:29 PM »
Be careful trying to cheat a CB inside.  There's a reason that every defense I'm aware of bases their CB's alignment off the #1 receiver.  Those guys have to be your last line of defense on any play, run or pass, headed for the sideline.  If your'e cheating him way inside and there's an eligible receiver outside of him, someone else better cover that guy and force runs back in.

I'd just try to keep this as simple as possible for the kids.  It's already a weird situation for them as well as you and you're already forced to make a bunch of wholesale changes just to play.  No need to pile on anymore than you have to.

The good thing is that it sounds like this team will be pretty bad.

Offline sabot6d

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Re: advice for odd problem
« Reply #5 on: August 19, 2017, 05:19:29 PM »
I agree completely about the backside CB cheating too far inside if there is an eligible receiver outside of him. It cant happen. Ive run alignments through what I can find to be the most common 8 man formations and i think Ive settled on the 3 alignments that cover as much as possible. There is just so much field to cover with 8 that I always feel like Im missing something.

Offline mahonz

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Re: advice for odd problem
« Reply #6 on: August 19, 2017, 08:16:14 PM »
So a 2-2 stack with both dogs 1 CB to Strength and the Reaper?

If that is what you are proposing then I understand and already did go over a similar look with the D on Thursday. It wasnt the reaper position, as it was 2 CBs still but weak side did play at full depth 10 yards and much more over the middle.

My experience with 8 man is exactly Zero so its a lot of on the fly adjustments in my thought processes.

Yes

Now you can play stack attack 8 man without retooling anything. If they only have 10 players you are going to wear them down anyway.

Now you can play full taps....or not with your bully boy DT's handling what could be at time only a 3 man surface. You can play a true 40 front with your OLB's. Your Dogs and Reaper....which is what makes this D roll....have no clue they are playing 8 man because everything is more normal for them. CB to the strength side or field side or to a SE.

8 man means more space so you should see more sweeping than you might expect. Dogs are hard to block on sweeps. Food for thought retooling your Offense.

Collect moments, not wins.

Offline sabot6d

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Re: advice for odd problem
« Reply #7 on: August 19, 2017, 10:09:33 PM »
Sounds good. It would appear that I was on a similar page. Thanks for the advice. We have a week to work out the kinks and then throw it all in the trash as we go right back to 11 for the rest of the games.

Offline mahonz

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Re: advice for odd problem
« Reply #8 on: August 20, 2017, 01:14:24 AM »
Sounds good. It would appear that I was on a similar page. Thanks for the advice. We have a week to work out the kinks and then throw it all in the trash as we go right back to 11 for the rest of the games.

Good luck.
Collect moments, not wins.

Offline sabot6d

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Re: advice for odd problem
« Reply #9 on: August 20, 2017, 10:04:17 AM »
Thank you

Offline CoachJJ

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Re: advice for odd problem
« Reply #10 on: August 21, 2017, 02:12:53 PM »
Most 8 man teams running our 33 Stack Attack are deleting NT, MLB and Reaper .... everyone else plays as usual ... all gaps filled and sound edge defense and pass defense ...
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Offline sabot6d

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Re: advice for odd problem
« Reply #11 on: August 21, 2017, 03:37:00 PM »
I read through the oldest posts on the topic and found an old discussion with you and tripwire. I made 2 basic alignments in my quick adaptation when I found out about the 8 man game.

a 3-1 and a 2-2. The 2-2 looked exactly like what you and trip were saying so apparently I at least halfway know what I'm doing. The 3-1 with just a middle stack was to get middle pressure with lesser athletes as I have 2 bruisers I can line up over a TE or outside shoulder of a guard and hold the B gap plus assist Dogs in outside contain.

I appreciate the feedback.