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Author Topic: Developing Coaches  (Read 53909 times)

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Offline MHcoach

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Re: Developing Coaches
« Reply #240 on: July 09, 2016, 10:54:30 AM »
The entire point being, is way too many here worry about finding the silver bullet instead of coaching their team to the best they can be. Over 13 seasons I started every game with the same play. My team knew it, even my opponents knew it. I had my arch rivals calling the play out in our calls as we came to LOS. Yet, it was always successful.

I have taught this play to many, only to watch half destroy it because they refused to listen & found excuses to change the particulars. The excuses range from we aren't fast enough, we aren't big enough, we aren't (insert lame excuse here). Funny thing is, I have taught it with fast & slow players , big or small, young & old. The key always was never comprising the integrity of the play. It was designed to work a certain way, the instant a coach changes those parameters it isn't the same play.

The common faults I have seen over the years is the FB being too slow to get there. My first response is, "Well than he isn't your FB". If he's the best you have then move him up a 1/2 step but change nothing else. Next is the RB changing his path to ensure the mesh. Now, he is running into the path of the blockers instead of the hole. We coached it so the back wouldn't veer inside or look for the ball, & especially not slow down or stop. It is the QB job to get there. If he's not getting there find out why. I guarantee he isn't taking the right steps.

When coaches try to change things to accommodate their players they need to know if it's important or not. Every year I attempt to get better, never by my own innovation rather by stealing from the best in the business. Then I will use it on a trail basis to see it work on grass. They key being knowing how things are supposed to work. Watching coaches trying to run a variation of a play or scheme when they first have never run that play or scheme is frustrating.

We are going to run Triple Option except there will be no option. Then you are running Dive, Keep, or Pitch don't call it Triple.

We are going to run Delaware Wing T, except we won't run the Buck Series. WTF

The examples are endless.

Joe
"Champions behave like champions before they're champions: they have a winning standard of performance before they are winners"
Bill Walsh

Offline mahonz

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Re: Developing Coaches
« Reply #241 on: July 09, 2016, 03:32:45 PM »
The entire point being, is way too many here worry about finding the silver bullet instead of coaching their team to the best they can be. Over 13 seasons I started every game with the same play. My team knew it, even my opponents knew it. I had my arch rivals calling the play out in our calls as we came to LOS. Yet, it was always successful.

I have taught this play to many, only to watch half destroy it because they refused to listen & found excuses to change the particulars. The excuses range from we aren't fast enough, we aren't big enough, we aren't (insert lame excuse here). Funny thing is, I have taught it with fast & slow players , big or small, young & old. The key always was never comprising the integrity of the play. It was designed to work a certain way, the instant a coach changes those parameters it isn't the same play.

The common faults I have seen over the years is the FB being too slow to get there. My first response is, "Well than he isn't your FB". If he's the best you have then move him up a 1/2 step but change nothing else. Next is the RB changing his path to ensure the mesh. Now, he is running into the path of the blockers instead of the hole. We coached it so the back wouldn't veer inside or look for the ball, & especially not slow down or stop. It is the QB job to get there. If he's not getting there find out why. I guarantee he isn't taking the right steps.

When coaches try to change things to accommodate their players they need to know if it's important or not. Every year I attempt to get better, never by my own innovation rather by stealing from the best in the business. Then I will use it on a trail basis to see it work on grass. They key being knowing how things are supposed to work. Watching coaches trying to run a variation of a play or scheme when they first have never run that play or scheme is frustrating.

We are going to run Triple Option except there will be no option. Then you are running Dive, Keep, or Pitch don't call it Triple.

We are going to run Delaware Wing T, except we won't run the Buck Series. WTF

The examples are endless.

Joe


Joe

How do you offset boredom?

I simple cannot stick with the same systems for more than a couple of seasons. It isnt challenging enough for me.

Basically I love the thrill of jumping off that cliff just to see if I can land on my feet.

Its not chasing a silver bullet per say because I know what it takes to win some  games but more so its chasing more knowledge.... and by golly this place makes my mind wander around most every day.
Collect moments, not wins.

Offline MHcoach

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Re: Developing Coaches
« Reply #242 on: July 09, 2016, 05:37:08 PM »
Mike

I have never said to run the same thing every year, rather run things the way they are supposed to be run. While personally I prefer to stay within the same "system" every year we evaluate our talent & go in the direction that best suits them. I get boredom, but winning is never boring.

The major point of this post isn't about what a coach runs, rather how they do it. I just see coaches making compromises to what they run because they can't teach the basics right. We will have 20 pages on something no one has ever ran, but how to teach tackling is 2 pages. Coaching is much more about how you do things than what it is you are doing.

Offensively I have been diversified over the years; however I have always focused on the how to block part of the game. I can guarantee we worry about blocking first. The season is almost here & see coaches making the same mistakes. I see guys who are consistently mediocre or worse trying to change how things should be done. Then they wonder why it isn't working.

There are other guys here who know every detail about a complex system, but can't teach their players a stance. The my players can't do it excuse is really I can't teach it. That's the whole point, if one player is doing something wrong it's probably his fault. If a majority of the players are making the same mistake it's a teaching issue. Success isn't a part of this equation. We all have something we could be coaching better.

Joe
"Champions behave like champions before they're champions: they have a winning standard of performance before they are winners"
Bill Walsh

Offline mahonz

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Re: Developing Coaches
« Reply #243 on: July 09, 2016, 05:44:02 PM »
Mike

I have never said to run the same thing every year, rather run things the way they are supposed to be run. While personally I prefer to stay within the same "system" every year we evaluate our talent & go in the direction that best suits them. I get boredom, but winning is never boring.

The major point of this post isn't about what a coach runs, rather how they do it. I just see coaches making compromises to what they run because they can't teach the basics right. We will have 20 pages on something no one has ever ran, but how to teach tackling is 2 pages. Coaching is much more about how you do things than what it is you are doing.

Offensively I have been diversified over the years; however I have always focused on the how to block part of the game. I can guarantee we worry about blocking first. The season is almost here & see coaches making the same mistakes. I see guys who are consistently mediocre or worse trying to change how things should be done. Then they wonder why it isn't working.

There are other guys here who know every detail about a complex system, but can't teach their players a stance. The my players can't do it excuse is really I can't teach it. That's the whole point, if one player is doing something wrong it's probably his fault. If a majority of the players are making the same mistake it's a teaching issue. Success isn't a part of this equation. We all have something we could be coaching better.

Joe


Makes sense. Thanks Joe.
Collect moments, not wins.

Offline MHcoach

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Re: Developing Coaches
« Reply #244 on: July 18, 2016, 06:25:37 PM »
When I ran the I , we followed everything Coach Osbourne did; & everything Coach Robinson did. Delaware Wing T we went & visited Coach Raymond. RnS we saw Coach Davis. Flexbone Coach Debarry & his staff. Spread it was Coach Meyer & his staff.

Sure we tweaked things over the years, but we always started out listening to those men. They get paid a lot more to do this than any of us.They know what the answers to any problems are.

This being said why is it I am seeing so many coaches wanting to change how things are supposed to be. I see crazy things like we want to run RnS but from the I Formation. This happens here as well as in my coaching office. I was explaining a front & how to coach it, an AC starts by asking why couldn't he does this or that. Calmly I explained the 2 primary reasons why not, only to be asked again why not. I finally lost my mind & replied you can F@#$ing do that way but than it's yours not what I'm showing you.

This seems to be rampant, coaches all want to come up with their own version of things; then blame the players when it doesn't work.It's all sound on paper, rarely sound on grass. Instead of investing the time to learn their craft coaches want to invent their own way & find an excuse when it doesn't work.

When someone who specializes in something gives advice I find it important to listen & not come up with reasons why not.

Joe
"Champions behave like champions before they're champions: they have a winning standard of performance before they are winners"
Bill Walsh

Offline akpoole

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Re: Developing Coaches
« Reply #245 on: July 18, 2016, 07:24:14 PM »
Mike

The my players can't do it excuse is really I can't teach it. That's the whole point, if one player is doing something wrong it's probably his fault. If a majority of the players are making the same mistake it's a teaching issue. Success isn't a part of this equation. We all have something we could be coaching better.

Joe


Coach, I couldn't agree with you more!  I CAN'T STAND TO HEAR COACHES SAY "He can't do it."  Because, just as you said, it's usually a teaching issue.  But some coaches (especially the new, gun ho ones,) don't want to listen to coaches who know what they may be talking about.  Thanks for this post and this topic.

God created five seasons:  Winter, Spring, Summer, Fall, and last but definitely not least . . . FOOTBALL!!

Offline Michael

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Re: Developing Coaches
« Reply #246 on: July 18, 2016, 09:49:10 PM »
You could probably stay occupied if you actually tried to get really good at whatever it is you're doing.
“If you can't explain it to a six-year-old, you don't understand it yourself.” ― Albert Einstein

Offline PSLCOACHROB

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Re: Developing Coaches
« Reply #247 on: July 18, 2016, 09:54:39 PM »
When I ran the I , we followed everything Coach Osbourne did; & everything Coach Robinson did. Delaware Wing T we went & visited Coach Raymond. RnS we saw Coach Davis. Flexbone Coach Debarry & his staff. Spread it was Coach Meyer & his staff.

Sure we tweaked things over the years, but we always started out listening to those men. They get paid a lot more to do this than any of us.They know what the answers to any problems are.

This being said why is it I am seeing so many coaches wanting to change how things are supposed to be. I see crazy things like we want to run RnS but from the I Formation. This happens here as well as in my coaching office. I was explaining a front & how to coach it, an AC starts by asking why couldn't he does this or that. Calmly I explained the 2 primary reasons why not, only to be asked again why not. I finally lost my mind & replied you can F@#$ing do that way but than it's yours not what I'm showing you.

This seems to be rampant, coaches all want to come up with their own version of things; then blame the players when it doesn't work.It's all sound on paper, rarely sound on grass. Instead of investing the time to learn their craft coaches want to invent their own way & find an excuse when it doesn't work.

When someone who specializes in something gives advice I find it important to listen & not come up with reasons why not.

Joe

You sound a bit disgruntled. I guess getting used to this bullshit isn't an option. People ask why I am taking a year off and may be hanging it up and it just boils down to I just refuse to deal with bs. I'd rather be a fan.

Offline MHcoach

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Re: Developing Coaches
« Reply #248 on: July 18, 2016, 10:34:14 PM »
Rob

I find it frustrating with people telling me what they can't do , never what they can do.

Joe
"Champions behave like champions before they're champions: they have a winning standard of performance before they are winners"
Bill Walsh

Offline angalton

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Re: Developing Coaches
« Reply #249 on: July 19, 2016, 12:47:29 AM »
I brought on a new assistant this year. He was a former HC, which is nice to have some experience. We have been practicing once a week for the last 5 weeks. We have been working on option wishbone, mesh, reads, and ball handling. Not many lineman so minimal blocking. Anyway, he shows for first practice last week and started throw out offensive plans. I told him again," We are running option out of multiple wishbone.". With that I told him Just watch what is going on and I will get him all the info on what we are running. With a negative kind of attitude, he says, option, under center, I don't think they can do this. So after telling him Just watch, because it will take all of us to work together to get working. He heads over where my other coaches are and I go take care of some sign ups for some of my players. I get back over to practice area and he comes up to me and is floored how well the players are running the offense. He asked how we got them performing so well. I said Dumcoach.com, multiple books, YouTube, and know what my players already new. Also I have it condensed down after 6months of studying it. I need you in board or not at all. Sometimes we have to listen without thinking what we want and know, first. I really hope it works out, because I have put together a great staff this year. We maybe on the lower half in talent, but I think we can win any and every game.
The greatest accomplishment is not in never failing, but in rising again after you fail.

Offline MHcoach

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Re: Developing Coaches
« Reply #250 on: July 26, 2016, 08:43:40 AM »
I wish someone could explain why coaches knock what they don't know & find a reason why it doesn't work without ever learning the basics. Last season I heard of a coach who for the last game of the season installed Triple Option with his team. The install lasted a total of 20 minutes. When it didn't work he commented, "Well I guess it doesn't work for 12 y/o's".When we installed the Triple our QB had made 5000 rides before we used it.

Coaches are under the misconception that DC is successful because he runs the UBSW, or DP because he runs the DW, or Tito because he runs the DWT. The real reason they are successful is because they can coach.

Joe
"Champions behave like champions before they're champions: they have a winning standard of performance before they are winners"
Bill Walsh

Offline Michael

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Re: Developing Coaches
« Reply #251 on: July 26, 2016, 08:48:22 AM »
This is from Bruce Campbell's book:

Horses are large animals that aren’t as dumb as people think.  They know when a rider doesn’t know what he’s doing and they’ll take full advantage of it.  Early on, I had a great deal of trouble with control – I couldn’t get my horse to go, and when I did, I couldn’t get him to stop.

“Hey, Gordon, this horse is being a pain in the ass.  What’s wrong with him?”

“I don’t know, let me get on him and take a look.”

The instant Gordon got on the horse, he would behave beautifully, following every command.

“Yep…must be the horse,” Gordon said as he dismounted.


I have it in my O-Line book.
“If you can't explain it to a six-year-old, you don't understand it yourself.” ― Albert Einstein

Offline jrk5150

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Re: Developing Coaches
« Reply #252 on: July 26, 2016, 10:51:43 AM »
I agree 100%.

I will frequently say something can't or shouldn't be done on here, but it's never about the kids, it's always about the coaches. I think many coaches try to take on way more than they can or should.

You have to know your limitations, both individually and as a staff.  For years now I have tried to use scheme a bit more than I should to overcome fundamentals - I know fundies come first, but I can only control what I can control, and sometimes that was limited when it came to fundamentals but unlimited when it came to scheme (staff dynamics).

This year will be interesting now that I'm the HC. I won't be able to break 11 years of habit overnight, but I'll see what kind of progress I can make in making our fundamentals better.

Offline MHcoach

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Re: Developing Coaches
« Reply #253 on: November 22, 2016, 07:39:52 PM »
Here is direct proof of what I am talking about:

Dave Potter, whom we all know is a die hard Double Wing coach, had to coach a team running TFS. Those 2 offenses are diametrically opposed. DP knew little about the TFS, so he studied & learned. He managed his team & coaches & had an excellent season. I'm sure given a choice he would have run the DW, yet he coached his team.

Joe
"Champions behave like champions before they're champions: they have a winning standard of performance before they are winners"
Bill Walsh

Offline user007

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Re: Developing Coaches
« Reply #254 on: November 22, 2016, 07:47:45 PM »
I wish someone could explain why coaches knock what they don't know & find a reason why it doesn't work without ever learning the basics. Last season I heard of a coach who for the last game of the season installed Triple Option with his team. The install lasted a total of 20 minutes. When it didn't work he commented, "Well I guess it doesn't work for 12 y/o's".When we installed the Triple our QB had made 5000 rides before we used it.

Coaches are under the misconception that DC is successful because he runs the UBSW, or DP because he runs the DW, or Tito because he runs the DWT. The real reason they are successful is because they can coach.

Joe

They can coach because they have put in the work. I am convinced what is missing in youth coaching is the understanding that it takes real work to be good. DP and DC, and Calande? I am sure I spelled that wrong so forgive me, all have put in long hard hours. It takes hard work. WE see it here all the time. Somebody creates a thread that says HELP! They want a magic pill. They 5 years looking for something they eventually discover isn't there. The discover success when they discover coaching isn't a hobby. It really is a way of life. But they do not want to admit that privately publicly. God forbid their priorities may be deemed out of order.
15 Study to shew thyself approved unto God, a workman that needeth not to be ashamed, rightly dividing the word of truth.
2 Timothy 2:15