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Author Topic: Developing Coaches  (Read 87903 times)

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Online MHcoach

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Re: Developing Coaches
« Reply #360 on: November 26, 2016, 07:37:06 PM »
J

That's why it's hard for me to watch film of my previous teams. Doesn't matter what they won, or how they won I only see the faults. I wonder were we really that bad?

DC

I know exactly what you are talking about. Mostly when I go watch a youth team practice I get a sick feeling in my stomach. GP's team was one of the rarity's I could see why he wins.

Joe
"Champions behave like champions before they're champions: they have a winning standard of performance before they are winners"
Bill Walsh

Online MHcoach

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Re: Developing Coaches
« Reply #361 on: November 26, 2016, 07:49:17 PM »
It's funny how almost all the coaches I talk to, want to know about schemes or what plays works against what. None ever want to talk about stances or how to block.

None ever ask how do I train a QB to throw, except Dave Cisar.

None ever ask how to teach tackling.

None ever ask about what stance I teach a LB.

They all want to know what blitzes I like.

Joe
"Champions behave like champions before they're champions: they have a winning standard of performance before they are winners"
Bill Walsh

Offline Michael

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Re: Developing Coaches
« Reply #362 on: November 26, 2016, 07:53:12 PM »
I never ask you about scheme.
“If you can't explain it to a six-year-old, you don't understand it yourself.” ― Albert Einstein

Offline COACH JC

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Re: Developing Coaches
« Reply #363 on: November 26, 2016, 07:53:30 PM »
J

That's why it's hard for me to watch film of my previous teams. Doesn't matter what they won, or how they won I only see the faults. I wonder were we really that bad?

DC

I know exactly what you are talking about. Mostly when I go watch a youth team practice I get a sick feeling in my stomach. GP's team was one of the rarity's I could see why he wins.

Joe


Joe,

That's why it bums me out that more coaches don't share their film & ask for an honest assessment. Like, do you want to be a better coach, or do you just want us to lie to you? Usually you're the last to know when you suck. lol

I took this year off. Guys I normally coach w/ asked me to come to practice & take a look, help out a little. They were a week away from game one. They looked HORRIBLE. Granted this was a down year in terms of talent, they weren't going undefeated either way. But their execution, & fakes, & all the small stuff was really bad. Felt like they had guys in the wrong spot.

Anyhow, they thought they were good to go. They really had a hard time taking in what I was telling them. They didn't blow me off,  but I could tell  they were a little dismissivs. Chalking it up to just my obsessive perfectionist nature.

Game 1 comes, they get shutout. 1st time in YEARS. Shutout by a slightly above avg team. Team we hadn't lost to in years.

Point being, sometimes you need need outside eyes to evaluate you. And you have to really try hard not to lie to yourself. Especially if you trust the eyes evaluating you.

Appreciate your openness tho. A national champion coach admitting "we should have been a lot better" should be an eye opener for everyone here.
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Online MHcoach

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Re: Developing Coaches
« Reply #364 on: November 26, 2016, 08:08:38 PM »
J

The first year I left MH, I went to watch my old team at the Nationals. Our TB had only been 13 & a 7th grader the year before. They replaced many of our players with even better talent. The guys coaching the team were guys I had coached with before or had mentored. So I went to their games honestly rooting for them.

First game they played an inferior team, yet struggled. At half time the OC asked me what I saw, I told him to run this play or that play only to hear "Oh we don't have those in, we didn't need them". This is the very thing I have spoken about in this thread, they were coaching to beat the mediocre teams not the really good ones. When they got to the championship they lost to a team with inferior talent but superior coaching. Without any of the complimentary plays they had no answer for a team who took away the base plays. Since then no one has made it back to FL.

Joe
"Champions behave like champions before they're champions: they have a winning standard of performance before they are winners"
Bill Walsh

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Re: Developing Coaches
« Reply #365 on: November 26, 2016, 08:20:30 PM »
Joe,

That's why it bums me out that more coaches don't share their film & ask for an honest assessment. Like, do you want to be a better coach, or do you just want us to lie to you? Usually you're the last to know when you suck. lol

I took this year off. Guys I normally coach w/ asked me to come to practice & take a look, help out a little. They were a week away from game one. They looked HORRIBLE. Granted this was a down year in terms of talent, they weren't going undefeated either way. But their execution, & fakes, & all the small stuff was really bad. Felt like they had guys in the wrong spot.

Anyhow, they thought they were good to go. They really had a hard time taking in what I was telling them. They didn't blow me off,  but I could tell  they were a little dismissivs. Chalking it up to just my obsessive perfectionist nature.

Game 1 comes, they get shutout. 1st time in YEARS. Shutout by a slightly above avg team. Team we hadn't lost to in years.

Point being, sometimes you need need outside eyes to evaluate you. And you have to really try hard not to lie to yourself. Especially if you trust the eyes evaluating you.

Appreciate your openness tho. A national champion coach admitting "we should have been a lot better" should be an eye opener for everyone here.
You make my point. People have to be ready for the honest assessment. Most are not.
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Online MHcoach

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Re: Developing Coaches
« Reply #366 on: November 26, 2016, 08:38:58 PM »
There are 2 coaching maxims I try to live by. Both were given to me by my mentors & both are still true.

It's never what you know as a coach but what your players know on the field that counts.

Don't worry about out thinking the coach on the other side of the field, rather out think (insert age you are coaching) year old on the field.

Joe
"Champions behave like champions before they're champions: they have a winning standard of performance before they are winners"
Bill Walsh

Offline COACH JC

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Re: Developing Coaches
« Reply #367 on: November 26, 2016, 08:39:13 PM »
You make my point. People have to be ready for the honest assessment. Most are not.

Eh, sometimes it's about planting a seed. Most coaches are prideful & have an ego. So sometimes it seems like you're waisting your time, but the seed os planted, & every once in a while it becomes more.
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Offline ThunderFootball

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Re: Developing Coaches
« Reply #368 on: November 26, 2016, 08:48:41 PM »
Joe,

Kyle gave another good example. I've watched a million youtube videos, & never once posted a single comment under any of them. Just not my thing, even tho I love youtube & use it almost every day.

The more I think about it, I think this site is for the die hard nerds. Everyone else just gets to enjoy the fruit of our discussions.

And i'm always hearing about how these flamed discussions are a waste of time. & yet i've probably learned more from those discussions than any. If you guys didn't kill me in my SW thread, i'm prob not even posting here right now.  But you guys called me out, held back no punches, & that thread helped completely change who I am as a coach.

I've watched a lot of youth games. Watched a lot of film from coaches on this board. Frankly, 95% of the film I watch is not good at all. What I would consider extremely poor. Includining my own film from a few years ago. And frankly I wish more people had the balls to just come out & be honest w/ each other. Cuz that's the only way we're gonna ger better.

Few years ago I gave iur game film to a top notch WT coach. Told him to break it down & hold nothing back. It was film of an undefeated team, & i thought he was just gonna gush about how awesome we were. Instead he basically pointed out how bad we really were. To his eye, there were very few things we did right.

Holy crap was that an eye opener. But man, when I compare our film now to that team then, I see exactly what he was saying. We sucked. And if he had sugar coated it, we'd still suck.

I think it was three years ago I sent CoachJC my film on belly and belly sweep. Can't remember his exact word but he basically said it was garbage. It was as I look back now. Guess what play we run much better now?  Why? Because JC told me it was garbage, but explained how to fix it.

Thanks again BTW.

Offline ThunderFootball

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Re: Developing Coaches
« Reply #369 on: November 26, 2016, 09:20:44 PM »
I've just started coaching hockey for my youngest son this year as an asst.  I have no hockey experience. I found out that one of the other dads who helps has a lot of experience coaching hockey and sometime we run drills together. I told him today that if he sees me doing something wrong to please correct me. He really didn't say much until I added that was the only way I was going to learn and get better.   He looked surprised I would say that.   Now I'll be asking him questions each time I see him.

I guess most people hate that feeling/being told theyre wrong. I just hate being wrong and losing more.

Offline COACH JC

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Re: Developing Coaches
« Reply #370 on: November 26, 2016, 09:45:28 PM »
I think it was three years ago I sent CoachJC my film on belly and belly sweep. Can't remember his exact word but he basically said it was garbage. It was as I look back now. Guess what play we run much better now?  Why? Because JC told me it was garbage, but explained how to fix it.

Thanks again BTW.

No problem brotha. Iirc, you asked me to be honest, which oppened the door for real improvement.

Over the years as we try to modern our offense after HS & college teams, i've constantly been confronted w/ the idea "well, maybe they just cant do this." When it doesn't click right away, it's really easy to settle for close enough.

It's so much easier to just have a half assed mesh & fake, then it is to CONSTANTLY remind them OVER & OVER & OVER to hold that mesh point, score on your fakes. I mean, if you slack off for even one day, they'll revert back to what's easiest. 

There was a time where I thought it was IMPOSSIBLE to make our Belly sweep look like Bellevue's. The idea that we could mesh like that & fake like that, just seemed impossible. But I now know we can. I've seen it. We're still not where we want to be, but we're REALLY close. When I told you your belly sweep looked like crap, so did ours! But I had seen us run the perfect belly sweep in practice. I saw it once or twice in a game. I knew it could be done, & the only reason we weren't perfect at it was cuz I didn't demand perfection on every rep. I settled.

To me, that's what this stuff is all about. We know in our minds what the play should look like when it's ran perfect. We just have to make the decision on if we're gonna settle for good enough, or keep chasing perfection.
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Online MHcoach

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Re: Developing Coaches
« Reply #371 on: November 26, 2016, 09:57:28 PM »
J

That's the thing, it's not that i am looking at my team without the same critical eye. I've done clinics where coaches make oh's & ah's & yet as I watch I will say something like the QB was a little late there. It's never about being perfect but rather the chase of perfection.

Joe
"Champions behave like champions before they're champions: they have a winning standard of performance before they are winners"
Bill Walsh

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Re: Developing Coaches
« Reply #372 on: November 26, 2016, 10:06:39 PM »
J

That's the thing, it's not that i am looking at my team without the same critical eye. I've done clinics where coaches make oh's & ah's & yet as I watch I will say something like the QB was a little late there. It's never about being perfect but rather the chase of perfection.

Joe


Yep. I just started coaching semi-pro, & it's funny. All the same issues we have w/ 13 year olds, we have w/ grown men. They don't want to carry out their fakes or ride that mesh point. Like, I have to harp on them every stinking play. If I relax a little, within an hour our meshpoint is gone. Obviously this dissipates as the season goes on, but it's just funny how the thigs I used to just settle for & chalk up to age, are still present w/ grown men. 

This is prob TMI & a little emberassing, but almost every night, when my head hits the pillow, I fall asleep obsessing about perfect mesh points, adjustments & fakes. lol. I can create perfection in my brain, but still chasing it on the turf.
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Re: Developing Coaches
« Reply #373 on: November 26, 2016, 10:21:43 PM »
J

I started coaching Semi Pro in my early 20's, many of the players were older than I was. Far & away youth was easier because they didn't know everything. Respect had to earned on the Semi Pro level. Only through hard work & coaching intensity was it earned. Win a few games & it's amazing how the respect would go up.

The biggest problem I had coaching Semi Pro was watching the gate. We always found ourselves watching the gate at practice or games to see who would come walking in. Believe it or not we ran more complicated scheme with our Youth team than we did at the Semi Pro level.

Joe
"Champions behave like champions before they're champions: they have a winning standard of performance before they are winners"
Bill Walsh

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Re: Developing Coaches
« Reply #374 on: November 26, 2016, 11:47:56 PM »
J

I started coaching Semi Pro in my early 20's, many of the players were older than I was. Far & away youth was easier because they didn't know everything. Respect had to earned on the Semi Pro level. Only through hard work & coaching intensity was it earned. Win a few games & it's amazing how the respect would go up.

The biggest problem I had coaching Semi Pro was watching the gate. We always found ourselves watching the gate at practice or games to see who would come walking in. Believe it or not we ran more complicated scheme with our Youth team than we did at the Semi Pro level.

Joe


Oh, I believe it. These guys were basically running a spread BLOCK SOMEONE system. They brought me & my buddy on because they cant get over the hump (shocker lol).

It's gonna be a major challenge, but i'm super excited to see the Wing T ran at that level. Literally every team in the league runs the spread, & we're gonna come in and base out of the Wing T (we'll still run spread & some Malzahn stuff).

When we get going & playing games i'll post some video. Should be interesting to see if we can get full buy in.
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