Author Topic: Defending the UBSW Offense  (Read 148865 times)

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Offline mahonz

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Defending the UBSW Offense
« on: June 07, 2014, 04:05:59 PM »
Gents

Last Off Season I did an on line clinic for C-Rob.  I touched on many different things about my Defensive Philosophies. Generally how we do more with less. I am not a fan of blitzing a lot and believe there are situations that call for a Defense to make some adjustments designed specifically for the upcoming opponent. I don’t mean a particular stunt per say but some adjustments to your base Defense.

http://www.coaches-clinic.com/index.php/clinics/defensive-clinics/general-defense/38-the-less-is-more-approach-to-defense

Many will say don’t run Defense’s, run a Defense. I agree but sometimes you have to think outside of that box. Defending the UBSW is one of those situations where some thinking outside of the box is required IMHO.

Real quick a little background on this. I didn’t make this up. We ran the UBSW very successfully for 3 seasons in the late 1990’s and got our butts handed to us one day by an 80 year old DC that actually played his College ball in the UBSW Offense…leather helmets and all. This was at the MS Level so our UBSW was very dynamic and quite multiple. I was lost and we got hammered 35-0. We also won the Championship that same season. Go figure.

This Coach was nice enough to buy me lunch afterwards and gave me all the ingredients for what he just did to us. Since then we have used this Philosophy whenever we play the UBSW, which is often since it is popular in my Town. I have shared it with others on this Forum and it has worked for them as well. I also have received many PM’s and emails asking if I could further explain some things. I have also received some feedback on a  few adjustments some have made that make perfect sense when it comes to cross training. So I have been working on this in my spare time the last few months.

This is not meant to become a chalk war. Its meant to help those that have not had to defend the UBSW yet or already have and struggled. Its is also meant as a tool for those that currently run the UBSW to get better.

Whenever I help out a fellow Coach when dealing with the UBSW I always tell them that unless the opposing Staff isn’t very good at what they do or unless you simply out man the opponent the UBSW is going to make some plays on you. Period. This Defensive Philosophy is meant to keep the opponent in check and make a game of things. The UBSW is very unique…it is new to modern era thinking but it is as old as football itself.

I am simply sharing my experiences in hopes to level the playing field when that day comes when you have to defend that funny looking Offense.

If you have ANY questions just post away. Im not interested and will delete posts that attempt to turn this into a who has the biggest dick contest. Help me help you and if you have and suggestions please by all means help me. Currently we do not have an UBSW Team in our Division but that could change at any time. It is very popular around here.

The attached slides basically take the 60 front and progress it into our UBSW Killer. If you run a 40 front you are 90% there already. We actually run this out of a 50 front and have used it VERY successfully vs other Winged teams like the Double Wing and Wing T. Basically any opponent that is a bit on the smoke and mirrors side we will go into this Philosophy.

The idea is to stay out of their way and actually allow the plays to develop. This will force more punts or more 4 and outs and it will absolutely help take away the home run plays that are killers. IMO the UBSW has some of the best Counters in all of football.

I can get into defending a Spread SW as well if interested. Its about the same…just different.

The last slide is how we ran our Defense vs an UBSW Team we played twice in 2012 as 3rd graders. We lost to them in the regular Season but beat them in the Playoffs on our way to a Championship. This opponent was very good….best Team we played that season IMO. The video attached is a few snippets of our Defense from that Playoff Game vs that UBSW.  The only adjustment we made for the Playoff Game is we had our DE on the Strong Side MAUL the WB every play and fired one of our CB's during the Regular Season. He turned into a pretty good WR though so he was fine.

Thanks.   






















PS...Bill, this GINORMOUS post uses no bandwidth. Im REALLY liking this Photobucket thing.  ;) ;)
« Last Edit: June 07, 2014, 09:20:15 PM by mahonz »
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Offline PSLCOACHROB

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Re: Defending the UBSW Offense
« Reply #1 on: June 07, 2014, 05:04:32 PM »
Mike,
    Just out of curiosity, what version of the sw did you run? I have looked at this defense before and it certainly creates problems. Especially for teams that install the base and not much else. Too many teams running Dave's system only install the bare minimums because they do well with it. Chalk wars are silly. In a typical youth game there are no eyes in the booth. We could chalk war all we want here but it matters very little on game day. The kids gotta execute and the coaches either pick up on what you or doing and adjust(if they have the adjustments installed) or lose. That goes for every game we coach in. Plus, good coaches don't need an opponent in a chalk war, they know how teams will adjust.
 

Offline mahonz

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Re: Defending the UBSW Offense
« Reply #2 on: June 07, 2014, 05:28:00 PM »
Mike,
    Just out of curiosity, what version of the sw did you run? I have looked at this defense before and it certainly creates problems. Especially for teams that install the base and not much else. Too many teams running Dave's system only install the bare minimums because they do well with it. Chalk wars are silly. In a typical youth game there are no eyes in the booth. We could chalk war all we want here but it matters very little on game day. The kids gotta execute and the coaches either pick up on what you or doing and adjust(if they have the adjustments installed) or lose. That goes for every game we coach in. Plus, good coaches don't need an opponent in a chalk war, they know how teams will adjust.
 

R

Thank you for that! Just trying to put some stuff out there that has worked for us. Too may want to try and overload some of these type of Offenses and I believe that is the wrong way to go.

We ran Kueffles version....I think...but Im pretty sure. That was a long time ago. Three digit play calling system...sound familiar?  When I moved to Phoenix I was hired to be the OC for a HS Freshman team. The Freshman DC was way into the SW Offense so he introduced it too me. He had his book and many other tid bits. When I realized HS Football regardless of the level was no longer the hobby I wanted it too be I left and got a Team of 6th graders. So I installed the UBSW. I also had wasted 20 bucks on John T Reeds SW book but never used it except for kindling when we went camping.
« Last Edit: June 07, 2014, 05:29:56 PM by mahonz »
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Offline akpoole

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Re: Defending the UBSW Offense
« Reply #3 on: June 07, 2014, 07:24:44 PM »
Thanks for posting this coach.  As a matter of fact, this D looks pretty familiar.  I think I've seen this or something real similar to this.  I printed off the diagrams and I'm going to STUDY them. :D
God created five seasons:  Winter, Spring, Summer, Fall, and last but definitely not least . . . FOOTBALL!!

Offline MHcoach

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Re: Defending the UBSW Offense
« Reply #4 on: June 07, 2014, 08:32:44 PM »
Mike

This is very similar to what I did. We would roll that FS up & he would key the BB. The big difference to what we did was to have the Strong Side DL's play on the line & the other side attack. Our base D was a penetrating front so this was a slight departure from what we normally did. Our CB's played 1/2 deep & keyed #1 to their side.

Being totally honest I only faced UBSW twice, once at Mint Hill & once with a MS team. The MS team was fairly well coached & made adjustments. We won that game 28-12, the Youth Team we beat 56-0. I know neither were the quality of a DC team. I have only played 3 DW teams. The results were roughly the same. Again those teams weren't the caliber of a DP team or  Jack team.

Joe
"Champions behave like champions before they're champions: they have a winning standard of performance before they are winners"
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Offline PSLCOACHROB

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Re: Defending the UBSW Offense
« Reply #5 on: June 07, 2014, 09:15:17 PM »
R

Thank you for that! Just trying to put some stuff out there that has worked for us. Too may want to try and overload some of these type of Offenses and I believe that is the wrong way to go.

We ran Kueffles version....I think...but Im pretty sure. That was a long time ago. Three digit play calling system...sound familiar?  When I moved to Phoenix I was hired to be the OC for a HS Freshman team. The Freshman DC was way into the SW Offense so he introduced it too me. He had his book and many other tid bits. When I realized HS Football regardless of the level was no longer the hobby I wanted it too be I left and got a Team of 6th graders. So I installed the UBSW. I also had wasted 20 bucks on John T Reeds SW book but never used it except for kindling when we went camping.
Mike,
   Keuffel used a numbering system but it was 2 numbers. The first number is the type of snap and then the next number was the poa. Cisar does not vary his snaps like the old sw teams did due to his system being youth based. The old sw center was a very specialized player and does not translate well to youth football. What I think you ran was Fritz Crisler's version(same thing but more complicated). Dr. Keuffel simplified Caldwell's(Princeton) sw. Maybe Dr. Keuffel used a 3 number system as did Crisler in the earlier version of his book. I have the newer edition so I can't say. Bill or Bob would probably know those details.

Offline mahonz

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Re: Defending the UBSW Offense
« Reply #6 on: June 07, 2014, 09:21:21 PM »
Thanks for posting this coach.  As a matter of fact, this D looks pretty familiar.  I think I've seen this or something real similar to this.  I printed off the diagrams and I'm going to STUDY them. :D

A

I had a double in there that I fixed....Slide #5.

Hope it helps!
Collect moments, not wins.

Offline mahonz

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Re: Defending the UBSW Offense
« Reply #7 on: June 07, 2014, 09:32:54 PM »
Mike

This is very similar to what I did. We would roll that FS up & he would key the BB. The big difference to what we did was to have the Strong Side DL's play on the line & the other side attack. Our base D was a penetrating front so this was a slight departure from what we normally did. Our CB's played 1/2 deep & keyed #1 to their side.

Being totally honest I only faced UBSW twice, once at Mint Hill & once with a MS team. The MS team was fairly well coached & made adjustments. We won that game 28-12, the Youth Team we beat 56-0. I know neither were the quality of a DC team. I have only played 3 DW teams. The results were roughly the same. Again those teams weren't the caliber of a DP team or  Jack team.

Joe

Joe

The DW was everywhere around my League mid 2000's. I was a Gofer for the Championship Games that year and I probably watched 5 DW Teams play in 10 Games. One Game was two DW Teams going at it and it was probably the most exciting Game of the entire weekend. Crazy good Teams.  Now it has virtually disappeared?

Thanks to coaches like Cisar the UBSW is alive and well. We have played some good ones and some bad ones. The Flagship team in my Org that is the same grade as my Team ran it for 2 Seasons and they did very well with it. Odd thing happened....the Parents all got together and got the HC fired for running that funny looking Offense. Typically our Org doesn't listen to that crap but they did this time? I feel bad for the SW guys sometimes...they are so misunderstood and it is a very good Offense.  I hate defending it...I hold my breath every dang snap.
« Last Edit: June 09, 2014, 03:42:52 PM by DumCoach »
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Offline mahonz

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Re: Defending the UBSW Offense
« Reply #8 on: June 07, 2014, 09:38:05 PM »
Mike,
   Keuffel used a numbering system but it was 2 numbers. The first number is the type of snap and then the next number was the poa. Cisar does not vary his snaps like the old sw teams did due to his system being youth based. The old sw center was a very specialized player and does not translate well to youth football. What I think you ran was Fritz Crisler's version(same thing but more complicated). Dr. Keuffel simplified Caldwell's(Princeton) sw. Maybe Dr. Keuffel used a 3 number system as did Crisler in the earlier version of his book. I have the newer edition so I can't say. Bill or Bob would probably know those details.

R

It was Aldrich ! Man it was right on the tip of my tongue since you asked me and I keep thinking it was an "A" Coach but I kept thinking Ahern.... but I had not discovered him until the Conclave about a dozen years ago.

Aldrich...with that 3 digit play calling system he had. I do remember that because we ran the 3 digit Wing T system for a few years in the early 1990's.

Yep...Aldrich.
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Offline PSLCOACHROB

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Re: Defending the UBSW Offense
« Reply #9 on: June 07, 2014, 09:54:25 PM »
And that is a version that I am not familiar with. I bet it is not too far from what Caldwell ran at Princeton. Now you gave me something else to do, damn it. I know of Aldrich but haven't looked at a playbook.

Offline davecisar

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Re: Defending the UBSW Offense
« Reply #10 on: June 08, 2014, 10:40:00 AM »
Joe

The DW was everywhere around my League mid 2000's. I was a Gofer for the Championship Games that year and I probably watched 5 DW Teams play in 10 Games. One Game was two DW Teams going at it and it was probably the most exciting Game of the entire weekend. Crazy good Teams.  Now it has virtually disappeared?

Thanks to coaches like Cisar the UBSW is alive and well. We have played some good ones and some bad ones. The Flagship team in my Org that is the same grade as my Team ran it for 2 Seasons and they did very well with it. Odd thing happened....the Parents all got together and got the HC fired for running that funny looking Offense. Typically our Org doesn't listen to that crap but they did this time? I feel bad for the SW guys sometimes...they are so misunderstood and it is a very good Offense.  I hate defending it...I hold my breath every dang snap.


You cant please everyone- especially in youth football

Personally Ive never had any issues with it, averaging over 35 ppg and about 12-13 different kids scoring every year over the last 18 seasons
Last 5-6 years lead very big league in passing TDs

When you win most of your games and retain almost all of your players, most parents are pretty happy. If they aren't, then they can play elsewhere.

But some people change for changes sake, guys like you change offense almost every year

Not everyone running the SW is running my version of it- this film has a bunch of stuff we don't do and is missing a bunch of key stuff we do use
The deal with my system is it ISNT just a playbook. It cant be got off of looking at some youtube videos or rummaging through an old playbook
The reason we win about 90% of our games has to do with our practice methodology, team management, team chemistry/motivation approach, blocking, game management, defense, special teams etc etc

Even here on the forum- a few guys have changed, not many, 3 I know of
One a few years ago went from supposedly my SW- to DW
He wasn't running my stuff well, he didn't even have the basics down- per discussions on key basics on that thread
I told him to keep us posted on his scores and predicted he would fail- He never posted scores- Im assuming he failed.
Another 2 guys here who now post went from my system, 1 to Pro and 1 to Spread. Both were tutored in detail by the experts in those offenses.  Both failed to win half as many games as they did running my stuff

Everyone has their own motivations for doing what they do- more power to you

Personally I coach to help develop a love in the game in the players and develop them as players and people
I also coach to win- that's why you keep score
« Last Edit: June 09, 2014, 03:45:43 PM by DumCoach »
However beautiful the strategy, you should occasionally look at the results.

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Offline MHcoach

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Re: Defending the UBSW Offense
« Reply #11 on: June 08, 2014, 11:11:22 AM »
DC

Most of the UBSW, probably aren't your version,or only a simple version. I have only played against it twice so I am no expert on defending it. It does present some challenges to defend. Other then watching your cut ups or Apopka's I really don't see it otherwise.

As far as guys changing from it, we have had this discussion, I have no idea why someone who goes 10-1 wants to change. I understand the 7-4 guys looking for an edge, & you are right often when they change they go 4-7. Mike is of course an anomaly & changes offenses like we change underwear. He winds up running Beast anyway.

The real question is how do you defend it. In the coaches office we always ask, if we were playing us what would we do? So the question becomes what do you do when you play UBSW?

Joe
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Offline davecisar

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Re: Defending the UBSW Offense
« Reply #12 on: June 08, 2014, 11:27:05 AM »
Joe

I wouldn't put together and special defense
We would run what we run with a few basic small adjustments- Those are already in the adjustments part of our defensive playbook

Back in Omaha where I had 16 teams in then the largest league there- we would play each other some at the "B" levels. I think we played 1 of our teams that year and won. When I moved to near Lincoln, we would play the old Omaha program in non league games. I think we played them 5-6 times. In total I think the teams I coached were 7-0 in those games. Most of them wouldn't go past the basics and even taking that away- their fundys and execution weren't as good as ours.

A LOT of guys running my stuff get overconfident
They are blowing teams out scoring 30-40+ pts per game
They think "if it isn't broke don't fix it"
So they don't bother getting better at the passing game
They don't bother adding in any adjustments
They don't go beyond the basic 5-6 plays like the team in this video or add in non complementary plays that DONT put any additional stress on the D  ( I counted at least 5 plays that aren't mine in it)
They don't put in a single key breaker play
They don't bother getting good at getting into efficient plays (using the keys I provide them)
However beautiful the strategy, you should occasionally look at the results.

Winston Churchill

Offline MHcoach

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Re: Defending the UBSW Offense
« Reply #13 on: June 08, 2014, 11:51:57 AM »
DC

I know exactly what you mean, at Mint Hill we had guys who tried to imitate what we did & often left important plays out. They didn't understand the actual concept of what we were trying to do.

When I was at the Private school we knew we didn't have an answer, because of our talent. So, we worked extra hard at trying to have an answer. Guys think well we scored 30 against team X that means we should score 30 against Y. When You play teams that are poorly coached & don't scout it doesn't matter, somewhere along the line you will face better coaching & scouting.

The first year I left Mint Hill, the 8U team was loaded with talent. I went & watched them in the Nationals. None of my staff was coaching, but a couple of my players were playing. They told me they were running "My Offense". It wasn't anything close to what I did. They never bothered to scout for their next game. Needless to say they didn't win. I think from the outside looking in what a team does can appear easy, because good coaching makes it look easy. The truth is no one ever sees the work that actually goes in.

When someone asks what defense I hate seeing, I always reply the on that tackles well. The truth is every season we have a plan to attack any defense we see. It changes from year to year depending on the make up of our team. Just because we have a plan, it doesn't mean it will work, but at least we are prepared.

Joe
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Offline mahonz

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Re: Defending the UBSW Offense
« Reply #14 on: June 08, 2014, 12:20:53 PM »

You cant please everyone- especially in youth football


Dave

I have to wonder how they feel now. They went backwards in the W/L column and for them it is all about winning.
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