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Author Topic: Confused! How would you all handle this dilema?  (Read 4627 times)

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Offline Coach Davis

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Re: Confused! How would you all handle this dilema?
« Reply #15 on: March 16, 2012, 04:22:09 PM »
I believe I can but it is not a sanctioned or official kind of thing. It would just be getting kids together at a local park and working it that way. Camps and the like are fine with the league so long as no league officials are present and it is not mandatory. And plays for the upcoming season can not be taught, yeah right! Like people listen to that!
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Offline CoachBrian

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Re: Confused! How would you all handle this dilema?
« Reply #16 on: March 16, 2012, 05:17:16 PM »

As far as him playing two ways…is the QB in your O a handoff machine or a run/ pass QB threat? If the latter…..NO DEFENSE. If the former then that policy is dumb. Looking at your profile and assuming your son is still pretty young...he could possibly go two ways under all circumstances but in my mind not much beyound 11 or 12 if he is indeed the cog in your O.

I put a ton of stock in the QB position and they DO NOT play defense. I think in the last 10 years my QB’s have probably played a total of 10 downs on the D….for fun. The best QB I have coached during that time played exactly ZERO downs on D in the 4 seasons he played for us. BUT….he was slow and the worst tackler on the team so they didn’t want him.



I definitely see the point in not playing your QB on defense when they get older, but at this age level I don't see a problem with it and if that QB is one of the best defenders too you are now keeping him off the field when you need him on defense.  At the under 10 age level it is unlikely that their QB is throwing the ball very much.

Last year our best QB was also the best defender and best running back.  We played him at running back and MLB.  Our 2nd best QB was one of the top three or four defenders.  We made him the starting QB and a starting outside linebacker.  He got hurt (nothing serious) twice during the season.....both times from the QB position.  One time was the last play of the game and the other time he only missed one offensive series and went back in.

Offline CoachJJ

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Re: Confused! How would you all handle this dilema?
« Reply #17 on: March 16, 2012, 05:18:24 PM »
OK Coaches, I am in a bit of a quandry!

Yes you are ... coaching your son is never easy ... I was lucky with my oldest who always played Center and only had to hear a few whispers about 'daddy ball' making him a starter ... and it was always from the parents of the backup Centers ... LOL

But my younger son was actually a backup QB for the first couple years he played and I often had coaches on the staff ask me to make him the starter ... we never did and the sport outgrew him to the point where is a great wrestler today but doesnt even think about playing football (106 lbs in 9th grade) ...

My daughter didnt play football but my wife and I actually did the worst job with her because she is a left handed softball player and all the years we coached her we kept her from playing first or pitching (only 2 spots a leftie can play in the infield) ... so she is now playing catchup as the coaches love her bat but she is just average playing first and doesnt throw hard enough for pitcher ... so had we just put her on first all along she would be farther along and we both feel bad about it ... the truth is she was always good enough to play first but we didnt want the parents to accuse us of putting her there because of favoritism ...

At the end of the day, coaches kids are quite often the ones who should be playing QB or RB or whatever ... and no matter what you do you cant win in this situation ... even Bambi had enemies and you will too ... if your boy wants to play QB and you werent coaching, you would take him the yard and work with him ... and that is what you should do even as a coach ... work with your son on WHATEVER HE WANTS so he can try out for whatever position he desires ... does he have an unfair advantage ... yes he does ... but that is life ... if life was meant to be fair we would all be the same height, shape, speed and have the same perfect parents that are geniuses and superior athletes ... you can not raise your son worrying about what other people think ...

Now that is NEVER the answer to why an inferior child should get to start at QB or anywhere else on the field ... but if he is honestly the right man for the job and he wants the job then he should be allowed to go out for that spot ... even if it means you move from OC to doing another job on the team to avoid a conflict ...

As a HC, I never let my 'dad helpers' (I hate to call guys Asst Coaches until they earn it) ... but I never let the Dads coach the position their son plays ... it keeps some of the chatter down ... so at that point is it more important to be the OC ... or more important to let your son make his own way ... not saying you arent willing ... just progressing to the next step of the conversation ...

I hope this helps ... it is definitely a no win dilemma ...
Coach JJ
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Offline Coach Davis

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Re: Confused! How would you all handle this dilema?
« Reply #18 on: March 16, 2012, 05:37:35 PM »
JJ,
I have offered to step down from the position but the HC said that he wasn't going to let that happen. He said to let him deal with the chatter and the "daddy ball" BS. But for me I have family in the stands and they get to hear that very chatter throughout the game! I have gone so far as to tell him that I would become a parent in the stands if need be.

We had discussions in our coaches meetings, as we have 4 coaches on the staff with kids on the team, I suggested that we 4 should have no say and can not lobby for our kids to play a particular position. It should be left up to the other coaches on the staff. We will have evals for all positions and the best kid in the eyes of the staff will be awarded those spots. I thought that was a logical approach, but we'll see!
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Offline DL

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Re: Confused! How would you all handle this dilema?
« Reply #19 on: March 16, 2012, 07:35:58 PM »
If your son is the best QB he should play QB, if he isn't than he shouldn't.

Work with him day and night all off season.  Nothing wrong with that.   He still has to beat the other kids out come pre-season. 

Good to get a 2nd and 3rd opinion though.   Real hard to be objective with your own kid. 

Start with the objective criteria:

1. Speed
2. Size
3. Arm
4. Ball Handling or just Hands

If there is another kid who is clearly superior in these attributes then he should be the starter at QB despite any intangibles you may feel your kid has. 

If it is close than you can go to intangibles like intelligence, attitude, coach-ability, poise, and leadership. 

Certain intangibles will disqualify a better qualified athlete like poor intelligence, poor attitude or poor poise.  Also, depending on the offense the better athlete may be better off in another position.  Make sure those poor intangibles are reality though and not wishful thinking.



 


« Last Edit: March 17, 2012, 04:09:05 PM by Daniel Lyons »

Offline durfee4

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Re: Confused! How would you all handle this dilema?
« Reply #20 on: March 16, 2012, 07:52:33 PM »
If your son is the best QB he should play QB, if he isn't than he shouldn't.

Work with him day and night all off season.  Nothing wrong with that.   He still has to beat the other kids out come pre-season. 

Good to get a 2nd and 3rd opinion though.   Real hard to be objective with your own kid. 

Start with the objective criteria:

1. Speed
2. Size
3. Arm
4. Ball Handling or just Hands

If there is another kid who is clearly superior in these attributes then he should be the starter at QB despite any intangibles you may feel your kid has. 

If it is close than you can go to intangibles like intelligence, attitude, coach-ability, poise, and leadership. 

Certain intangibles will disqualify a better qualified athlete like poor intelligence, poor attitude or poor poise.  Also, depending on the offense the better athlete may better off in another position.  Make sure those poor intangibles are reality though and not wishful thinking.



 
Agree, he won,t be 10 and under for ever prepare him for the future.Lots of good post nice debate.The HC will have to make the right decision for the team.If he,s the best for the postion so be it ,all complaints go to him.We as coaches must prepare to coach,teach fundementals ect,ect get ready for the seaon. jmo  Mahonz nailed it also. Oh one more thing,kids excell in what they love to do!
Success only comes before Work in the dictionary

Offline CoachJJ

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Re: Confused! How would you all handle this dilema?
« Reply #21 on: March 16, 2012, 11:20:34 PM »
JJ,
I have offered to step down from the position but the HC said that he wasn't going to let that happen. He said to let him deal with the chatter and the "daddy ball" BS. But for me I have family in the stands and they get to hear that very chatter throughout the game! I have gone so far as to tell him that I would become a parent in the stands if need be.

We had discussions in our coaches meetings, as we have 4 coaches on the staff with kids on the team, I suggested that we 4 should have no say and can not lobby for our kids to play a particular position. It should be left up to the other coaches on the staff. We will have evals for all positions and the best kid in the eyes of the staff will be awarded those spots. I thought that was a logical approach, but we'll see!

Sounds like you have a decent handle on it Coach ...

If your boy belongs at QB, then put him there ...
Coach JJ
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"Football may be the best-taught subject in American High Schools because it may be the only subject that we haven't tried to make easy."

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  Erasmus Hall High School - Brooklyn, New York

Offline Coach Davis

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Re: Confused! How would you all handle this dilema?
« Reply #22 on: March 17, 2012, 01:39:29 AM »
If in this situation would you guys just say screw it and teach your kids the position an techniques for you offense while playing in the yard?
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Offline CoachJJ

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Re: Confused! How would you all handle this dilema?
« Reply #23 on: March 17, 2012, 03:26:45 AM »
If in this situation would you guys just say screw it and teach your kids the position an techniques for you offense while playing in the yard?

Ummm yep ...
Coach JJ
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Offline CoachDavidP

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Re: Confused! How would you all handle this dilema?
« Reply #24 on: March 17, 2012, 03:30:08 AM »
If in this situation would you guys just say screw it and teach your kids the position an techniques for you offense while playing in the yard?
Most definitely. At home, you're dad, not coach. At this level, his natural athletic ability will keep him primed for defense anyway. Working at qb skills wont hurt him. Just make sure that when it comes time, he understands the decision will not be up to you.
David (Fizzlife)

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Offline Coach Davis

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Re: Confused! How would you all handle this dilema?
« Reply #25 on: March 17, 2012, 05:51:04 AM »
Thanks a lot to for all the comments and help that I have been able to get from the forum. Can only hope I can return the help someday.
"ALWAYS LEARNING AND TRYING TO IMPROVE. SUCH IS THE LIFE OF A COACH!"

Offline jrk5150

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Re: Confused! How would you all handle this dilema?
« Reply #26 on: March 17, 2012, 11:28:55 AM »
Teach the crap out of him in the back yard, for sure.

2 comments about once the season starts.

1.  If he wants a shot at QB, give him a shot at QB.  Like you would ANY kid on the team.

2.  Parent preseason meeting - HC should address this very issue.  Look, there are parents coaching, and here's how we handle it - parent coaches don't make position/starting decisions for their own kids.  We're looking out for the TEAM when we make these decisions, we are NOT looking out for each other's kid.  One of the coach's sons may try out for QB.  If he's the best candidate IN MY OPINION as the HC, we'll put him there.  MY DECISION.  If anyone has an issue with that, please feel free to come see me, there's nothing secret about what we're doing here, that's why I'm explaining this now.  What I don't want to hear are the comments and insinuations during the season that we heard last year, that were frankly baseless, but also petty and juvenile.  If you as an adult want to engage in that nonsense, please collect your son, turn in your equipment, and go play for another team.


Get out in front of it.

True story - we had a coach in our program at the mitey mite level (7-8's).  His parent meeting, he addressed this very issue, but he went about it a bit differently.  Paraphrasing - he basically said I'm putting the time in, I'm the HC, I have the whistle, so my son is playing QB, and the other coach's son was going to be the primary RB.  If you have a problem with that, either grab a whistle and volunteer or go play for another team (which actually isn't really an option around here).

That team had been ours the year before, we (HC and I) had moved up to the Jr. PW level.  I had one of the parents come to me - her son was their best player, a RB (in fact I had considered staying and taking over that team just to coach him another year) but he wasn't playing RB because of the Daddy ball.  She asked me to come over to their practice and just watch.  So we ended early one day, and I wandered over and stood with her.  I couldn't believe my eyes.  They had 30 kids lined up single file, one on one tackling drill, two kids at a time.  One coach supervising, the other 3 coaches off to the side, backs turned, BS'ing with each other.  They did that for 20 minutes.  I know we talk about that crap on here, I didn't realize that coaches actually did that for real, LOL.  If I hadn't seen it, I wouldn't have believed it.

Offline durfee4

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Re: Confused! How would you all handle this dilema?
« Reply #27 on: March 17, 2012, 12:13:58 PM »
Teach the crap out of him in the back yard, for sure.

2 comments about once the season starts.

1.  If he wants a shot at QB, give him a shot at QB.  Like you would ANY kid on the team.

2.  Parent preseason meeting - HC should address this very issue.  Look, there are parents coaching, and here's how we handle it - parent coaches don't make position/starting decisions for their own kids.  We're looking out for the TEAM when we make these decisions, we are NOT looking out for each other's kid.  One of the coach's sons may try out for QB.  If he's the best candidate IN MY OPINION as the HC, we'll put him there.  MY DECISION.  If anyone has an issue with that, please feel free to come see me, there's nothing secret about what we're doing here, that's why I'm explaining this now.  What I don't want to hear are the comments and insinuations during the season that we heard last year, that were frankly baseless, but also petty and juvenile.  If you as an adult want to engage in that nonsense, please collect your son, turn in your equipment, and go play for another team.


Get out in front of it.

True story - we had a coach in our program at the mitey mite level (7-8's).  His parent meeting, he addressed this very issue, but he went about it a bit differently.  Paraphrasing - he basically said I'm putting the time in, I'm the HC, I have the whistle, so my son is playing QB, and the other coach's son was going to be the primary RB.  If you have a problem with that, either grab a whistle and volunteer or go play for another team (which actually isn't really an option around here).

That team had been ours the year before, we (HC and I) had moved up to the Jr. PW level.  I had one of the parents come to me - her son was their best player, a RB (in fact I had considered staying and taking over that team just to coach him another year) but he wasn't playing RB because of the Daddy ball.  She asked me to come over to their practice and just watch.  So we ended early one day, and I wandered over and stood with her.  I couldn't believe my eyes.  They had 30 kids lined up single file, one on one tackling drill, two kids at a time.  One coach supervising, the other 3 coaches off to the side, backs turned, BS'ing with each other.  They did that for 20 minutes.  I know we talk about that crap on here, I didn't realize that coaches actually did that for real, LOL.  If I hadn't seen it, I wouldn't have believed it.
Agree 100%,This will be my sons the 3-4 year at fb and I,ve coached him up in the off season.But when we hit the feild he,s just another peace to puzzle.I coach the O-line and D-line ,and over see all,even though he,s on my team,which by is by our by-laws,we put him at the best position,and he,s very good at it.This is his last year before he hits MS,and I,ll still be here helping kids.We do have a back up fb not as big but gets the reps in and playing time. Yes  some dads coach for their kids and not for team and it does reflect the whole team,and the end of season it shows .Me I would,nt put hundreds of hours reserching asking questions,clinics,ect  to coach 1 year .I feel like many coaches on here they do it for the game.
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Offline Luc

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Re: Confused! How would you all handle this dilema?
« Reply #28 on: March 17, 2012, 12:52:37 PM »
If in this situation would you guys just say screw it and teach your kids the position an techniques for you offense while playing in the yard?
-- daddy-coach rant --
That's what I do. I actually went with him to the park for 3 years before I signed him on a football team.
The first year at camp he was chosen as QB (I was not coaching, so I had nothing to do with that).

He scored more than half the points of his team with less than 25% of the carries. Some parents complained that he had the ball too much (well duh, give the ball to 3 different players, for a total of -5 yards, he gets the ball on forth down, and run 50 yards for a score, they still complain).

Some parents complained enough that they moved him to safety on defense and put another kid at QB. First two passed by the other team ? Two picks by my son, one ran back for a TD. The whole team had NO interception in the previous 7 games. Now, he gets BENCHED on the next drive, because you know, we have to have the other kids play too... Now he is not playing on offense, and he is not playing on defense because... He is too good ???

Next series the other team scores, and bang, it's a tied game. After we kick (yes, not a single first down on offense with him on the bench), they put him back at safety, and believe it or not, he gets another pick for 6. So our team is up 1 TD at the half...

After that game, I decided I would coach the next year. So I did. Last year, he was 8 on a 8-9 years old team with mostly 9 years old "vets". He was probably #3 to #5 best player on the team, I was OC and he wasn't my QB (he was backup) because I had a better 9 years old for QB. There were less complains, but there will ALWAYS be complains.

This year we will be DW team, and I have already been outside with him teaching him EVERY POSITION on the offense, including pulling guard. I already told him that he might play at any position this year depending on the talent of the other players, and the need for the team. I even told him he might start at QB (he doesn't like the idea for some reason) if I need him there. He takes the reps, he learns, he practices hard, footsteps, L.E.G blocking, running at the right spot, doing his fakes 20 yards down, running his passing routes perfectly, passing, the whole thing.

Is it fair for the rest of the team ?

The whole team will be better with a player like that willing to play ANY POSITION to help the team. I don't stop any other parent/dad to go and practice with their kid. Not my problem if they don't, I'll try to coach their kids the best I can.

But what I do in my backyard with my son ? That is my business.

I don't think you have a problem. Not at all. Not with teaching him anyway.

You want to coach your son ? Get ticker skin. That's your only problem. Don't forget, even Bambi had enemies :)

Sorry about the looooooong rant  ;)
-- daddy-coach rant over and out --
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Offline Luc

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Re: Confused! How would you all handle this dilema?
« Reply #29 on: March 17, 2012, 12:58:06 PM »
2.  Parent preseason meeting - HC should address this very issue.  Look, there are parents coaching, and here's how we handle it - parent coaches don't make position/starting decisions for their own kids.  We're looking out for the TEAM when we make these decisions, we are NOT looking out for each other's kid.  One of the coach's sons may try out for QB.  If he's the best candidate IN MY OPINION as the HC, we'll put him there.  MY DECISION.  If anyone has an issue with that, please feel free to come see me, there's nothing secret about what we're doing here, that's why I'm explaining this now.  What I don't want to hear are the comments and insinuations during the season that we heard last year, that were frankly baseless, but also petty and juvenile.  If you as an adult want to engage in that nonsense, please collect your son, turn in your equipment, and go play for another team.
Great advice. Putting that on my parent meeting speach. Thanks!
To be good you have to work hard. To be better, you have to work harder. To be great, you have to keep working when the good ones stop.