Fire Zone concepts

[CoachCalande]

Coaches, if you run any 3 under, 3 deep coverages, do you prefer to have your unders take flat, hole, flat or seam, hole, seam?

....how do you assign your under zones...are you assigning each man a 1/3rd ? That seems simplest and most logical with the seam players carrying a possible fourth vertical release. (rerouting).

[Wing-n-It]

I would usually have the unders take flats and hole as this is the most dangerous to me for youth.

Besides its easy to teach the hole to the non blitzing LB.

Flats are an easy teach for the OLBs.

You have more time than most of us so I may not have helped you any 

[ZACH]

Fire zone : send 5 drop 6 is this correct?

If it is ide have a curl flat player in the field and 2 hook curl players. Vs straight drop, vs rollout playside hook curl player presses qb backside hook to curl rotates to mid whole

[mahonz]

Steve

I went and checked my semi pro notes because we used Fire Zones and now I remember the issues that may or may not help.

We had to avoid using Mike for the Hole because he was a big bad bully boy that couldn’t cover a house playing this position. So when using our Fire Zones Mike was always one of the 5 bringing pressure. We also had to avoid using him as a robber....but that was minor.

Trips with or without a TE was a bear but you have to remember we only practiced once a week. You should have time to coach it up….we relied on their experiences and communications on the field with very little actual practice. The problems were deep rubs ( post / post corner / dig or bench) and there is no way you can cover the bubbles / missiles if the QB has a strong arm. That was a problem.

Other than that it worked well as long a we had a plan for Mike.

Under takes Hole to Flat and Seam only if from twins….over is deep thirds with the outside defenders always jumping anything to their sideline. 

****Disclaimer. Not a chance I’d teach Fire Zones to youths. First its not necessary and second its not necessary.

[defensewins]

Sounds like you want to spot drop in your fire zone.  I don't know of a coach that spot drops his underneath coverage on fire zones...

However...Justin Wilcox (DC at Tennessee, now at U of Washington) went through this long drawn out explanation on how he teaches fire zones.  He then went through that if he coached HS, and his kids couldn't get how to SCF (seam, curl, flat...the most integral part of 3 deep 3 under), he would spot drop the SCF defenders with relationships to the numbers.  No wider than the number unless the ball was in the air.  They have numbers to 1 yd inside hash.  If the SCF defender was to the field in a multiple receiver look, he would split the numbers and the hash. 

[mahonz]

Sounds like you want to spot drop in your fire zone.  I don't know of a coach that spot drops his underneath coverage on fire zones...

However...Justin Wilcox (DC at Tennessee, now at U of Washington) went through this long drawn out explanation on how he teaches fire zones.  He then went through that if he coached HS, and his kids couldn't get how to SCF (seam, curl, flat...the most integral part of 3 deep 3 under), he would spot drop the SCF defenders with relationships to the numbers.  No wider than the number unless the ball was in the air.  They have numbers to 1 yd inside hash.  If the SCF defender was to the field in a multiple receiver look, he would split the numbers and the hash.

DW

Certainly not my expertise....but isn't Fire Zones spot dropping?

Can you elaborate?

[CoachCalande]

IM reading the Leo Hand notes on abel, baker, charlie and how to play the fire zone concept underneath...

playing two, keying 3 etc.

[defensewins]

DW

Certainly not my expertise....but isn't Fire Zones spot dropping?

Can you elaborate?

SCF (Seam, Curl, Flat) are his rules and priorities.  He is reading #2 all the way. 

If #2 is vertical, the SCF player runs with him up to 12-15 yards.  If #2 is still vertical, and there is no receiver in the curl or flat area, the SCF player will continue to carry #2 (obviously with help over the top). 

If #2 is vertical (after carrying him to 12-15 yards) and a receiver enters the curl area, the SCF defender will break off of #2 for the receiver in the curl area. 

If #2 is vertical (after carrying him to 12-15 yards) and a receiver enters the curl area and a different receiver is in the flat (maybe a back out or something),  the SCF defender will break off of #2 and still play the receiver in the curl area. 

So...he is pattern reading #2 to #1 (essentially), rather than spot dropping. 

Obviously though, there are many ways to skin the cat...

[CoachShad]

My question becomes if I pattern read I'm gambling that the QB will have already decided where to throw the ball before I have to decide?  If they flood a particular Zone then I take a chance leaving the 4th Vert open, right? 

Not criticizing just asking.   To defeat this scenario, as a defense, I have to know who his hot read should be. right?

[CoachCalande]

Fire zone (to me) is about playing a 3 deep zone, vacating 2 of the underneath zones via blitz, covering the 3 zones with 3 defenders.

From there, you stop the vertical release and pass them off to jump the flats....essentially, if im the  will backer and the spur to my side blitzes, i have to cover the flat, but im not going to ignore a quick seam route to do that. 

playing 2 and 3 as a bracket with the next linebacker inside is essentially what it comes down to...ie 2 comes inside, ill cover him unless 3 goes outside.   the inside backer will stay wiht the 2 then as he crosses unless his 4 comes across and he passes that 3 off to the outside zone (ie a mesh pattern).


Just think "in and out" coverage essentially. - no sense in jumping to the flat if noone is in it.

[CoachShad]

With Jack's Defense it simply becomes 3rds over (Tampa) so we are indeed spot dropping. One thing to remember about this defense is that both DE are bringing pressure however, they read the QB essentially the DE facing the QB will stop and drop to align between himself and the QB's face mask, what amounts to the Flat-Swing area.   

[CoachCalande]

I hear this expression for non pattern reading teams (spot droppers)

"we will trade the completion for the concussion"

Ill never say that, itd get me sued but I do understand the thinking, you are vacating zones, you are spot dropping for simplicity and doing your best to read both the qb and the receivers at the same time- Ultimately, i think this is what will realistically happen anyhow.

its intersting to see the abel, baker, charlie concept used wiht man coverage.

[defensewins]

My question becomes if I pattern read I'm gambling that the QB will have already decided where to throw the ball before I have to decide?

Yes and no...They are all following their rules.  However, I see what you're saying.  But, that is the same time, in any zone the defenders are reading something and/or following rules.  A coach can run whatever route directly in front of a defender that is spot dropping and be "open" all day long. 

Even in a spot dropping cover 3, the FS will read the shoulder of the QB and cheat to that side.  In this case, the FS would be "gambling" that the QB decided where the ball is going.  (I wouldn't use the term "gambling," but it is probably more of a semantics issue than a conceptual issue). 

If they flood a particular Zone then I take a chance leaving the 4th Vert open, right?

 

Which is true of spot dropping or pattern reading 3 deep coverage.

Not criticizing just asking.   To defeat this scenario, as a defense, I have to know who his hot read should be. right?

I do not believe a defender has to know the hot read.  A coach should to make sure the call he makes marries up to the concept being ran. 

[durfee4]

Was,t sure of how to understand Fire Zone concepts so I went looking.Good stuff. http://coachhoover.blogspot.com/2012/01/strong-scrape-fire-zone-and-fire-zone.html

[mahonz]

Was,t sure of how to understand Fire Zone concepts so I went looking.Good stuff. http://coachhoover.blogspot.com/2012/01/strong-scrape-fire-zone-and-fire-zone.html

D

You can go to the 33 download section on this forum as well. There are a few 33 fire zone powerpoints.