Author Topic: Requirements for Lineman in Zone Blocking?  (Read 9684 times)

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Offline MHcoach

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Re: Requirements for Lineman in Zone Blocking?
« Reply #15 on: April 26, 2014, 11:38:31 AM »
Coach Davis

Every time you hear someone say you can't do that, simply think they can't do it because they can't coach it. Players will do what you coach them to do. Of course it's important to never ask a player to do something they can't do, so understanding physical limitations is important; however I know on grass Zone blocking works with Youth Players. I have seen teams as young as 9 win championships using a Zone scheme. I personally have won with big fast lineman, small slow ones, & some that could barely breathe.

One of my early mentors would always ask when someone said their team couldn't do some thing. "Is it they can't do it, or you can't coach it?" I don't want to hear from the "can't" guys, rather the "do" guys. The coach always limits what his team can do, hence the "Coach what you know" attitude. If you don't know, then learn & learn from those that do it best.

Joe
"Champions behave like champions before they're champions: they have a winning standard of performance before they are winners"
Bill Walsh

Offline Dusty Ol Fart

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Re: Requirements for Lineman in Zone Blocking?
« Reply #16 on: April 26, 2014, 03:38:07 PM »
Thanks For the Replies. I have heard a few different answers regarding zone blocking. Some have said if you don't have athletic lineman or big slow lineman don't run or teach zone blocking. Some of have said it's too much for youth players to pick up. Just trying to find different opinions.

I disagree, if they are Big and too Slow why are they on your line either way?  Linemen need to be Quick not Fast.  Fast Hands, Quick Feet.   

Another Question what would be you main reasons for teaching and running zone blocking or not teaching and running zone blocking?

There is only one reason not to teach Zone.  You, the Coach, don't understand Zone. 

Not MPP... ONE TASK!  Teach them!  :)

Offline coacho

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Re: Requirements for Lineman in Zone Blocking?
« Reply #17 on: April 26, 2014, 06:29:56 PM »
Coach,

I've run the JetSweep using an outside zone concept at the youth level for years. My quote to the linemen is' "If you don't have ability everything else matters". In my opinion, linemen must be communicators, intelligent and technicians.   

Offline mahonz

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Re: Requirements for Lineman in Zone Blocking?
« Reply #18 on: April 26, 2014, 07:08:25 PM »
Thanks For the Replies. I have heard a few different answers regarding zone blocking. Some have said if you don't have athletic lineman or big slow lineman don't run or teach zone blocking. Some of have said it's too much for youth players to pick up. Just trying to find different opinions.   

Another Question what would be you main reasons for teaching and running zone blocking or not teaching and running zone blocking?

D

Effort gets it done regardless.

Play the odds....since its a no pull scheme if you think you will see a ton of odd front play slow at OG....even fronts play slow  at Center. Either way you want your best at OT. If you run out of bodies flip your OL and play a Zone side and a counter side. Then run Zone and counter BOTH directions. Since its youth ball you really are not telegraphing anything...you are still capable of running left or right on any given play regardless of where your OL is aligned.

The reason Zone is a good deal at the youth levels....less teaching over the long haul giving you more time to teach better technique. You WILL create better blockers faster.

There is no down side that I have found unless you ignore the RB's and simply insist they are hitting a hole. There are no "holes" in Zone. They are running to monuments so the RB's MUST become part of the Zone. If not...Zone sucks.
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Offline MHcoach

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Re: Requirements for Lineman in Zone Blocking?
« Reply #19 on: April 26, 2014, 07:24:39 PM »
Mike

We usually have our better at Guard, simply because they will be involved in more of the combo's, & when we do pull we want an athlete. Given a choice, I would want bigger tackles with long wing spans. Tanks for guards who can move.

Last season, our Guards were 200 lbers, Center 255, & Tackles were 280 & 310. This season we are bigger, I don't know about better yet. The Guards need to be the better technique guys, remember the Tackles get help with the combo's. At the Private school our Tackles weren't any good, yet we ran for a ton yards. Our Guards could play though.

In Youth Football I always start with the Guards, size isn't as important as being a player. Usually our Guards were I FB's on other teams. The Center had to be reliable, not your best lineman, but reliable. Take what's left & make tackles.

Joe
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Bill Walsh

Offline mahonz

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Re: Requirements for Lineman in Zone Blocking?
« Reply #20 on: April 26, 2014, 10:00:50 PM »
Mike

We usually have our better at Guard, simply because they will be involved in more of the combo's, & when we do pull we want an athlete. Given a choice, I would want bigger tackles with long wing spans. Tanks for guards who can move.

Last season, our Guards were 200 lbers, Center 255, & Tackles were 280 & 310. This season we are bigger, I don't know about better yet. The Guards need to be the better technique guys, remember the Tackles get help with the combo's. At the Private school our Tackles weren't any good, yet we ran for a ton yards. Our Guards could play though.

In Youth Football I always start with the Guards, size isn't as important as being a player. Usually our Guards were I FB's on other teams. The Center had to be reliable, not your best lineman, but reliable. Take what's left & make tackles.

Joe

Joe

I like those OTs to be able to pass pro DE's too so they get a little extra attention from me on the athleticism scale...but heck who are we kidding...we want athletes at all 5 spots !....put big and slow at NG.  :P
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Offline MHcoach

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Re: Requirements for Lineman in Zone Blocking?
« Reply #21 on: April 26, 2014, 10:13:05 PM »
Mike

We use slide protection so we will slide to the better Tackle & let our back who is a better athlete handle the other edge.

Joe
"Champions behave like champions before they're champions: they have a winning standard of performance before they are winners"
Bill Walsh

Offline mahonz

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Re: Requirements for Lineman in Zone Blocking?
« Reply #22 on: April 26, 2014, 10:30:56 PM »
Mike

We use slide protection so we will slide to the better Tackle & let our back who is a better athlete handle the other edge.

Joe

Joe

Sliding does marry well with Zone. Another important point for coaches searching for a better way this off season. Anything that reduces the teaching process.

I wonder if anyone has ever posted up...tried the Zone thing......man it sure does blow chunks. I can only remember one coach stating he felt it made his OLM soft. No effort = soft. Im working with ONE soft kid right now. Man this kid is a bit of a head scratch'r. He can rag doll any kid on the field if he wanted too....he just wont do it? He is always smiling too. Today I told him to stop smiling when Im around.  ::)
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Offline Pearls of Wisdom

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Re: Requirements for Lineman in Zone Blocking?
« Reply #23 on: May 04, 2014, 12:28:13 PM »
Coach Mountjoy, I remember in one of your posts once talking about OL placement depended a little on the fronts you would see. I didn't take it as a hard fast rule but something like if you see a lot of odd fronts one might want their better reach blockers at guard. I might be completely imagining that or have it completely screwed up.

In one of the Gibbs videos he said he liked longer guys at tackle and shorter guys at guards. He also talked about having a cutoff on how tall he wanted his OL.

If opponents usually cover your G with DLM & your T with a LB = the G might need to be a little tougher & the T a little quicker.  If they put a LB on your G & a DLM  on your T the reverse would be true.
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Offline Idiotyouthcoach

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Re: Requirements for Lineman in Zone Blocking?
« Reply #24 on: May 23, 2014, 08:34:23 PM »
What would you say are the requirements for the Lineman in the Zone Blocking Scheme?    What would be the Pros and Cons in Teaching Zone Rather then Man Blocking?
1. Complete buy in.
2. Front family
3.covered/ uncovered
4.numbering defenders.
5. Call blocking/ rule blocking
6.mandate on communication
7. Practicing fast

Offline Roden10

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Re: Requirements for Lineman in Zone Blocking?
« Reply #25 on: July 28, 2014, 01:05:10 AM »
Coach Davis

The difference between Zone blocking & Man blocking is all in the way you coach it. Any lineman who is any good can do either if they are coached well.

IMHO, where Zone blocking excels is in the fact that we don't worry about who we are blocking just how. The downside is it has to coached correctly by a coach who understands what it is you are trying to do. We introduced Zone on Thursday, the brand new players understood what we are doing in less then a 10 minute install. Now they can focus on technique.

Joe

Do you have a post somewhere explaining your method of zone blocking. Particularly for youth but any would be good. I see lots of people commenting on your method but I can't find it.

I know zero about zone blocking. But I like the idea of spending more time on technique and less time on assignment.

Thanks,

Tim
Tim


If your feet aren't moving, you're not blocking!

Offline belebuch

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Re: Requirements for Lineman in Zone Blocking?
« Reply #26 on: July 28, 2014, 01:47:01 AM »
Check your pm coach.

Offline CoachDavidP

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Re: Requirements for Lineman in Zone Blocking?
« Reply #27 on: July 28, 2014, 10:39:36 AM »
Do you have a post somewhere explaining your method of zone blocking. Particularly for youth but any would be good. I see lots of people commenting on your method but I can't find it.

I know zero about zone blocking. But I like the idea of spending more time on technique and less time on assignment.

Thanks,

Tim

Joe did a nice three part series with Coach Hayes (BigB) on his podcast, The Red Zone.
David (Fizzlife)

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Offline Roden10

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Re: Requirements for Lineman in Zone Blocking?
« Reply #28 on: July 28, 2014, 11:03:18 AM »
Thanks. I will look for that.
Tim


If your feet aren't moving, you're not blocking!

Offline blockandtackle

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Re: Requirements for Lineman in Zone Blocking?
« Reply #29 on: September 23, 2016, 06:58:08 PM »
What would you say are the requirements for the Lineman in the Zone Blocking Scheme?    What would be the Pros and Cons in Teaching Zone Rather then Man Blocking?

Pros:

1.  Simple if you do it right--very few "rules" to remember as far as WHO to block.
2.  Handles stunts and slants much better.
3.  Can be recycled and combined with a variety of backfield actions to threaten a defense in numerous ways.  You can run Zone Read, Inverted Veers, and even Iso and Counter plays off it if you get creative without changing anything up front.
4.  Should theoretically be sound against anything.

Cons:

1.  Takes reps, just like anything.
2.  Your guys have to get off the ball.
3.  You have to be a good coach and know how to coach up OL technique--stance, start, feet, eyes, fit, hips, and finish.
4.  You have to teach the backs how to "read" the zone... both the QB if he's actually reading a defender for a give/keep and the back for how to read it for the crease.

As for "Man" schemes:

Pros.
1.  It's simple.  Just count or follow some acronym.
2.  Holes can be more clearly defined for the ball carriers.

Cons.
1.  It does not handle stunts, blitzes, or any kind of post-snap movement well.
2.  Tends to turn into a bunch of one-on-one blocks.
3.  Will sometimes encounter "holes" in the blocking rules that cause issues vs. certain fronts.
4.  More rules to remember.

Note: I consider "Man" different from "Gap" schemes on plays like Power, Counter, Trap, Buck Sweep, etc.