Author Topic: zone blocking in youth... diary of install for 10/11s  (Read 32248 times)

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Offline joshv155

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Re: zone blocking in youth... diary of install for 10/11s
« Reply #120 on: September 04, 2014, 04:40:04 PM »
Familiar w Joe's system - have discussed w him at length. Not what we do but works for him. Also understand Joe is primarily a read guy. I'd like to be too but first year w zone felt that was too much and unnecessary for us (in Fla 8A where Joe coaches, it is necessary - you can NOT count on blocking those DEs for 4 quarters).

However, I'm confused about a couple things you've said (maybe the kids are too - maybe I'm just misreading)...

1) So you read LB. He sits / attacks B - you cram behind C or T with no cut. If the initial aiming point is the T, how does he get to C with no cut? Seems like a cutback to me.

2) If 1st backer flows over top (outside), you replace him. OK - so again you're cramming, right? So IS there a bounce read the way you have this set up? If there is, it's not clear to me (based on what's been written here).

3) What dictates your cutback read?

Aiming point is the but of the tackle, the way the TB takes the handoff and is coming downhill angles at the OT's butt hitting C gap is a natural angle….so if the LB sits he can go right behind the OT (who should be double teaming the DT off the ball) or cram it into C gap. So butt if the tackle or C gap is where he is aiming. If the LB flows to C he plants and cuts back replacing the LB.

We not taught him a read to bounce it outside. It is get through the line based on the LB read then find the first seam and take it. Based on Joe's system of double teams at the first level and only worrying about the LB on run throughs we get a lot of movement on the D-line and they get pushed into the LB's laps. The DE's we see are usually wide 9's who box or crash. If they crash we will use our H to come over and help or crack them with the Z.

Hopefully that all makes sense and I am not screwing everything up with how I taught it. Joe has been crazy busy so haven't checked in with him for help in a bit.
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Offline mahonz

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Re: zone blocking in youth... diary of install for 10/11s
« Reply #121 on: September 04, 2014, 04:49:11 PM »
Look at the reads like this.

Why read the DLM?....because Alex Gibbs says so therefore he must be right...and he is....for the highest levels of football. He has to account for high level DLM that are athletes that can long stick two gaps and drop into coverage...1 gap...2 gap....cartwheel...etc. How often do we see that at the youth level?....like never. So why read the most static level on the Defense?

I quickly learned YEARS ago that if you are reading DLM the RB's eyes are down and his reads are muddy at best. Eyes up and reading the second level now you are reading the most active level on the Defense. How you apply that to your zone scheme is the thing to do IMHO. For me that has always been the first LB'r inside your POA because if you watch enough of your own youth level film one thing is true...the zone ALWAYS rotates away from the POA for your OLM and into the POA for the Defense. OZ rotates fast...IZ slow but it always rotates. Key on the most static level and you will leave yards on the field....key on the most active level and things open up...dramatically.

Zone plays off of what the D is doing at the snap....that is especially true when it comes to LB'rs. You have to make them wrong too.

My take.
 
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Offline CoachMattC

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Re: zone blocking in youth... diary of install for 10/11s
« Reply #122 on: September 04, 2014, 05:19:37 PM »
Aiming point is the but of the tackle, the way the TB takes the handoff and is coming downhill angles at the OT's butt hitting C gap is a natural angle….so if the LB sits he can go right behind the OT (who should be double teaming the DT off the ball) or cram it into C gap. So butt if the tackle or C gap is where he is aiming. If the LB flows to C he plants and cuts back replacing the LB.

We not taught him a read to bounce it outside. It is get through the line based on the LB read then find the first seam and take it. Based on Joe's system of double teams at the first level and only worrying about the LB on run throughs we get a lot of movement on the D-line and they get pushed into the LB's laps. The DE's we see are usually wide 9's who box or crash. If they crash we will use our H to come over and help or crack them with the Z.

Hopefully that all makes sense and I am not screwing everything up with how I taught it. Joe has been crazy busy so haven't checked in with him for help in a bit.

Shoot me a PM if you're confused or stuck with Joe's stuff. I'm not him by a long shot but I have spent a ton of time with him and ran his stuff for the last couple seasons. The thing about it is when it clicks, it gets really easy for the kids. If you or them are confused, something is wrong. I'm not going to go into his line calls publicly for both Joe's sake and mine.
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Offline joshv155

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Re: zone blocking in youth... diary of install for 10/11s
« Reply #123 on: September 04, 2014, 05:24:10 PM »
Shoot me a PM if you're confused or stuck with Joe's stuff. I'm not him by a long shot but I have spent a ton of time with him and ran his stuff for the last couple seasons. The thing about it is when it clicks, it gets really easy for the kids. If you or them are confused, something is wrong. I'm not going to go into his line calls publicly for both Joe's sake and mine.

Sounds good. His line stuff is in the red zone show broadcast from a couple years back. I was listening to it yesterday. Its the basic stuff.
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Offline Michael

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Re: zone blocking in youth... diary of install for 10/11s
« Reply #124 on: September 04, 2014, 05:32:05 PM »
Shoot me a PM if you're confused or stuck with Joe's stuff. I'm not him by a long shot but I have spent a ton of time with him and ran his stuff for the last couple seasons.

I believe Matt stayed at a Holiday Inn with him once.
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Offline ZACH

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Re: zone blocking in youth... diary of install for 10/11s
« Reply #125 on: September 05, 2014, 11:10:46 AM »
Mikes right to a point... I didnt like reading lbs bc in wide zone the rb can totally miss the center stretching a shade and we look like idiots.

Thats when I went to pre snap reap open gap system. Keeps vision up and should be clear as day to read.

I too have issues with bouncing plays vs a 9 tech. Even when you fire them its horrible
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Offline joshv155

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Re: zone blocking in youth... diary of install for 10/11s
« Reply #126 on: September 05, 2014, 02:44:33 PM »
In talking with MattC sounds like I am doing it correctly for Joe's system….whew…..and need to work with the backs a little more. I have not once gone over to the backs Indy's….I am always with the line and/or the WR's/QB's. Yesterday I went to the backs for about 25 mins. I felt kind of dirty being away from the line but I cleaned up a few things, I hope. Game 1 tomorrow night at 7pm.

Line looked pretty good yesterday. Everyday we do two step drills with our feet on the edge of the grass and stepping into the sidewalk. We were all together and form looked good. Worked on fit vs a defender after that then drive blocks, double teams and combo's. We are for sure better blockers than in the past because of all the time we spend on how to block and not who. Hopefully that translates over to the game.
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Offline GP

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Re: zone blocking in youth... diary of install for 10/11s
« Reply #127 on: September 05, 2014, 11:21:00 PM »
started "firing" the backs for wrong reads tonight - worked well.

one TB bounced a stretch when it was a clear cut read. i said "you're fired! do you know why you're fired?" he said "bc i should have cut it up." other TB bounced a power outside of the kickout - same deal.

worked so well i fired my right tackle for a false start. fortunately i didn't have to fire any assistants  :P
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Offline ZACH

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Re: zone blocking in youth... diary of install for 10/11s
« Reply #128 on: September 05, 2014, 11:34:40 PM »
started "firing" the backs for wrong reads tonight - worked well.

one TB bounced a stretch when it was a clear cut read. i said "you're fired! do you know why you're fired?" he said "bc i should have cut it up." other TB bounced a power outside of the kickout - same deal.

worked so well i fired my right tackle for a false start. fortunately i didn't have to fire any assistants  :P

Atta boy!
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Offline Michael

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Re: zone blocking in youth... diary of install for 10/11s
« Reply #129 on: September 05, 2014, 11:37:56 PM »
i fired my right tackle for a false start.

I'm OK with those.  I never even say anything.
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Offline ZACH

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Re: zone blocking in youth... diary of install for 10/11s
« Reply #130 on: September 06, 2014, 12:01:05 AM »
We never has issues bc we have code words or silent count
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Offline ZACH

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Re: zone blocking in youth... diary of install for 10/11s
« Reply #131 on: September 07, 2014, 09:33:44 PM »
Week 2

Played a heavy hitter program

First play from scrimmage we ran wide zone left from "trey over" a game plan formation. Went 50yds for a td

The game was 6-6 and they (opponent)  ate a lot of clock on offense. We had some nice drives cut short by bad mistakes in our pass game regarding qb roll, steps, ect

As far as zone went we did a few things different. We actually zone combo'd a stack over center. Center and backside guard picked it up well as I installed it during pregame warm up as a bsg with a 2 ft split will have trouble blocking a "solid" front.

I taught it as a take over. Center will anchor the nose bsg will get nose and fight to get square. In this process when the center feels hes being pushed off by bsg he will then climb.

We also worked on club technique at nauseum the week leading upto as my tackles were immediatley climbing vs these faster lbs.

All in all a better performance and we are getting better

Contemplating installing counter gap this week as we face a wt6 team with double white front
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Offline joshv155

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Re: zone blocking in youth... diary of install for 10/11s
« Reply #132 on: September 09, 2014, 10:24:46 AM »
Having issues with my center when he ends up 1 on 1 w/NG. When he knows he has help he steps and moves his feet and the NG gets driven back. When he knows he is alone he doesn't step. He plants his feet and just takes the blow of the NG hoping for a stalemate I think.

Worked on it in practice yesterday but it has been an issue all season so far.

Worked on power a ton yesterday. Pullers are not getting up into the hole fast enough. Playside guard was leaving the DT with the center way to early and so the center would not move his feet like described above. NG slid off a few times and got in the way of the puller....and RB had no where to go. Guard should not be coming off the DT and I think he gets it now.

Trying to decide whether to add stretch or not. Never have taught it so would need some advice. We are running zone, power, counter. We have truck toss in but haven't spent much time on it and didn't run it a singe time game one. It was all zone, 2-3 powers and 2 counters that went for 40+ each.

Would you add stretch or just keep getting better at what we are currently doing ? We run beast as well but only practice it about 15 mins a week.
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Offline ZACH

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Re: zone blocking in youth... diary of install for 10/11s
« Reply #133 on: September 09, 2014, 11:36:16 AM »
1 v 1 teach the club...they like it

Regarding pullers in power... its not far of a pull only 2 guys over in theory
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Offline CoachMattC

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Re: zone blocking in youth... diary of install for 10/11s
« Reply #134 on: September 09, 2014, 07:52:55 PM »
Having issues with my center when he ends up 1 on 1 w/NG. When he knows he has help he steps and moves his feet and the NG gets driven back. When he knows he is alone he doesn't step. He plants his feet and just takes the blow of the NG hoping for a stalemate I think.

Worked on it in practice yesterday but it has been an issue all season so far.

Worked on power a ton yesterday. Pullers are not getting up into the hole fast enough. Playside guard was leaving the DT with the center way to early and so the center would not move his feet like described above. NG slid off a few times and got in the way of the puller....and RB had no where to go. Guard should not be coming off the DT and I think he gets it now.

Very common problem. Center in this offense is a tough job. The first thing that most kids mess up is making their stance too wide. They want a good stable base to snap harder, but when their feet get too far outside their shoulders it makes it harder for them to step. Get on his butt about keeping his feet together.

Quote
Trying to decide whether to add stretch or not. Never have taught it so would need some advice. We are running zone, power, counter. We have truck toss in but haven't spent much time on it and didn't run it a singe time game one. It was all zone, 2-3 powers and 2 counters that went for 40+ each.

Would you add stretch or just keep getting better at what we are currently doing ? We run beast as well but only practice it about 15 mins a week.

Stretch was never a big hit for me last year. I skipped putting it in this year and use G a lot more instead. The thing I didn't like about stretch is the footwork is very different than anything else we do. Everything else blends together and Stretch is kind of an oddball scheme. Just my 2 cents.
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