Author Topic: Inside Zone Combos  (Read 12989 times)

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Offline blockandtackle

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Re: Inside Zone Combos
« Reply #30 on: November 26, 2016, 02:18:42 PM »
 

Coach

Do you do anything to help out your center?
Can you tell me about what the GCG would do for a 2i tech to the playside and backside.

That is a special case.

If there's a 2i or 1 backside, we teach the C to automatically "wrong step" and help out... but he still needs to keep his shoulders square and his eyes in play side A gap.  If a LB tries to run through that gap, he's got to step off the combo and pick that up.  It's not an easy block, but we don't want a 2i or 1 tech just running underneath our BSG and blowing up the RB.

Against a play side 2i, it usually works fine.  The C will snap and get over there.  The PSG will be working his "one arm bench press" rule through the 2i's play side number, and the C will get to him.  If we have a play side 2i who's really penetrating hard, we will sometimes tell the C to just open and cut him--by then, he'll have already shot the gap on the PSG, anyway.  Against a hard penetrating 2i, we're more likely to just down block him with the G on a gap scheme and run Iso or something instead.

Again... focus on the eyes and on seeing the play side gap with shoulders square.  That, along with the footwork, are key.

Offline blockandtackle

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Re: Inside Zone Combos
« Reply #31 on: November 26, 2016, 02:20:11 PM »
A

That is our OZ philosophy, IZ is all about the combo's & getting vertical. We use both.

Joe


We get pretty decent vertical movement on IZ when we use proper base blocking technique.  That's all we want them doing: base blocking what's in the play side gap.

We've experimented with OZ, but with Power, Counter, and Buck Sweep (and now Power Read), we just don't have much use for it.

Offline MHcoach

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Re: Inside Zone Combos
« Reply #32 on: November 26, 2016, 02:36:14 PM »
A

We have run OZ, but always were more of an IZ team.This last season OZ was our best run play. I think it had a lot to do with our O Line & back. Normally we need to have those combo's to move people. This year we were big so we could move people.

Joe
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Offline MHcoach

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Re: Inside Zone Combos
« Reply #33 on: November 26, 2016, 02:39:55 PM »
Where is the head placement of the post man?


LOL Post & lead, we haven't thought in those terms for ages. Hands to the near number Head to the near armpit is how we teach it. OZ we are trying to get to the outside # outside armpit.

Joe
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Offline ZACH

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« Last Edit: November 26, 2016, 08:59:30 PM by ZACH »
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Offline coachmsl

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Re: Inside Zone Combos
« Reply #35 on: November 27, 2016, 09:07:30 AM »
That is a special case.

If there's a 2i or 1 backside, we teach the C to automatically "wrong step" and help out... but he still needs to keep his shoulders square and his eyes in play side A gap.  If a LB tries to run through that gap, he's got to step off the combo and pick that up.  It's not an easy block, but we don't want a 2i or 1 tech just running underneath our BSG and blowing up the RB.

Against a play side 2i, it usually works fine.  The C will snap and get over there.  The PSG will be working his "one arm bench press" rule through the 2i's play side number, and the C will get to him.  If we have a play side 2i who's really penetrating hard, we will sometimes tell the C to just open and cut him--by then, he'll have already shot the gap on the PSG, anyway.  Against a hard penetrating 2i, we're more likely to just down block him with the G on a gap scheme and run Iso or something instead.

Again... focus on the eyes and on seeing the play side gap with shoulders square.  That, along with the footwork, are key.

Thanks Coach
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Offline coachmsl

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Re: Inside Zone Combos
« Reply #36 on: November 27, 2016, 09:08:39 AM »


LOL Post & lead, we haven't thought in those terms for ages. Hands to the near number Head to the near armpit is how we teach it. OZ we are trying to get to the outside # outside armpit.

Joe


Thanks Joe
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Offline coachmsl

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Re: Inside Zone Combos
« Reply #38 on: November 27, 2016, 09:38:34 AM »
Thanks Coach

The pictures didn't show up in the first doc.  Great info.

Do you lean more on the Man or Combo side of the spectrum of IZ?


Matt
Matt, I would very careful of zone blocking. You are not going to put in one blocking scheme and have it work for everything. Doesn't work that way. You may already know, but I thought I should throw it out there. Good luck.
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Offline coachmsl

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Re: Inside Zone Combos
« Reply #39 on: November 27, 2016, 10:10:05 AM »
Matt, I would very careful of zone blocking. You are not going to put in one blocking scheme and have it work for everything. Doesn't work that way. You may already know, but I thought I should throw it out there. Good luck.

Thanks oo7

Im not looking for a fix all.  There are a lot of ways teams coach IZ.  Some look for combos every way they can through calls and gameplanning.  Others want to keep them to a minimum and focus on hat on hat with a chip here or there.   I am looking to study that spectrum this offseason.  I did not do a good job coaching the combo in the past.  IF I am to coach the combo it would be wise to take a some time to relearn the techniques involved.  I have already picked up a few things.  We will see what this offseason teaches me, and where I fall on the spectrum next season.  Thanks for your help Coach!

Matt
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Re: Inside Zone Combos
« Reply #40 on: November 27, 2016, 10:14:40 AM »
Thanks oo7

Im not looking for a fix all.  There are a lot of ways teams coach IZ.  Some look for combos every way they can through calls and gameplanning.  Others want to keep them to a minimum and focus on hat on hat with a chip here or there.   I am looking to study that spectrum this offseason.  I did not do a good job coaching the combo in the past.  IF I am to coach the combo it would be wise to take a some time to relearn the techniques involved.  I have already picked up a few things.  We will see what this offseason teaches me, and where I fall on the spectrum next season.  Thanks for your help Coach!

Matt
If you insist on getting combos, you are going to run into problems. A good defense will try and prevent the combo. They can do that by playing downhill fast.
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Offline coachmsl

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Re: Inside Zone Combos
« Reply #41 on: November 27, 2016, 10:20:02 AM »
If you insist on getting combos, you are going to run into problems. A good defense will try and prevent the combo. They can do that by playing downhill fast.

oo7

Thanks for the advice.  We will see.  I know a few guys out there have success with combos in youth ball. 

Matt
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Offline MHcoach

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Re: Inside Zone Combos
« Reply #42 on: November 27, 2016, 11:16:08 AM »
007

LB's playing downhill fast isn't what breaks the combo's so much as walk up LB's. A walk up LB is no longer a LB but a DL. The way we run Zone we are reading the ILB anyway.

We have seen great success running Zone at the Youth level, but the devil is the details. You have to be able to coach all the moving parts & this often where guys fall short. The other thing you commented on was Zone can't be your only scheme, & it seems guys forget that. Zone is only the starting point.

Joe
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Re: Inside Zone Combos
« Reply #43 on: November 27, 2016, 11:36:17 AM »
007

LB's playing downhill fast isn't what breaks the combo's so much as walk up LB's. A walk up LB is no longer a LB but a DL. The way we run Zone we are reading the ILB anyway.

We have seen great success running Zone at the Youth level, but the devil is the details. You have to be able to coach all the moving parts & this often where guys fall short. The other thing you commented on was Zone can't be your only scheme, & it seems guys forget that. Zone is only the starting point.

Joe


Joe, I never said zone had to be your only scheme.  On the linebackers downhill, playing fast, IZ zone is going to be a direct read in most cases.  That means that those combos don't necessarily happen. If they do happen and your the OL responsible for the backer takes a bad angle, or gets held, you have a free backer. Maybe the better way to explain it, is the double teams is not an absolute.

I think you reading for pull like zone read and such. I am not. when I say read I mean the back having the read and I do it by the end or the like. I have no interest in spending time teaching the qb an option on any run play. That is a waste of time.
« Last Edit: November 27, 2016, 11:47:57 AM by user007 »
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Offline ZACH

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Re: Inside Zone Combos
« Reply #44 on: November 27, 2016, 12:24:02 PM »
Thanks Coach

The pictures didn't show up in the first doc.  Great info.

Do you lean more on the Man or Combo side of the spectrum of IZ?


Matt

We man most of it... only time we really combo in tight zone is to perform a slip. Or we call combos in which we do release from them.
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