Author Topic: Amoeba 33  (Read 2222 times)

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Offline Wing-n-It

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Re: Amoeba 33
« Reply #105 on: August 30, 2019, 04:18:48 PM »
1) When I learned wedge from Jack and JJ, it was their doctrine that they PREFER a NT
I probably got that from Jack as well as he taught me how to run the wedge even though I don't run his offense.
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2) Wedge is a "sell out" play. That is not meant as a slight in any way. You are selling out for vertical force. We will not play that game. We will have at least 6 defenders attacking the wedge from the flanks, where the wedge is most vulnerable.
This is why I said I would wedge your front very little because you and Mike understand its weaknesses and know how to stop it. Most don't. They think I'll just line up like "X" and that will stop that QB sneak. LOL

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3) Wedge often works because the defense is surprised. I love the wedge and used to run it all the time. I was always amazed how a defense could still be surprised the 10th time we ran it in a row. From 5 yards, you see it forming and might even pick up the exchange.
I once was up big and my O coord. called a play on 3rd and goal and I told him just to wedge it. it was getting too late to call in the play so as they were lining up I yelled to the QB "JUST WEDGE IT!!" the opposing team heard me and they frantically yelled to their team "QB SNEAK, QB SNEAK" couple seconds later we were standing in the endzone. I am a firm believer that most teams are just not prepared to face something like that. Or the beast

Its like Mike Tyson said "Everyone has a plan , Until you get punched in the face"


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question:  Does a defense lining up in an 80 front discourage you from running wedge? If not, then how does the front even matter?
No front scares me, as I have seen a 10-1 line up to stop our wedge. The hardest team I had trying to wedge was a 6-2 ghost. That defense took away everything I tried to do mostly because the kids were coached very well. It was one of the only defenses to take away my TE. Thankfully the game has a game clock and time expired otherwise I would still be losing to them.
I fear a good coach more than a 15 player defense

To Dave, I run motion every play so I run motion first play just to see if a defender follows him

When the kids are taught ; "If this player does this, you do this" I want to see what they were told. I also look at DE play once the ball is snapped. How you play your DEs and motion, I know what plays I am going to call.
If I ran the DW I would just shove that ball down the throat of the defense. With the way I play the WingT I look for what the defense will give me. I rarely block DEs


Robert

2 Things my offense will always have is a Wing and a Wedge

Offline tiger46

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Re: Amoeba 33
« Reply #106 on: August 30, 2019, 06:35:42 PM »
Ya think?  For the life of me, I don’t understand that defensive alignment....

—Dave

CoachDP,

It was their response to our offense after the first game that we played against them. In the first game we wedged the hell out of them. Then we would run off-tackle and jet sweep.  I guess their DC was determined not to get beat by those plays in the second game. 

Those coaches weren't near the caliber of Mahonz & Gumby.  But, from the experience, I could see some good coaches taking a similar configuration and possibly turning it into some sort of weird topnotch defense.  I don't know Mahonz or Gumby personally or ever even talked to either one on the phone  But, from reading their posts and threads; who better to try something a little less ordinary than those two?
“It is easier to build strong children than to repair broken men. ”  ― Frederick Douglass

Offline Wing-n-It

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Re: Amoeba 33
« Reply #107 on: August 30, 2019, 06:39:00 PM »
they do like to tinker, Mostly Mahonz
Robert

2 Things my offense will always have is a Wing and a Wedge

Offline gumby_in_co

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Re: Amoeba 33
« Reply #108 on: August 30, 2019, 11:25:11 PM »
Lar,

How would you rank the positions in order of placement (starting talent)?

Reaper
Dogs
CBs
OLBs
DTs
ILBs

Would be my guess.

Dogs
Corners
(Understand this is 3rd grade “sweep ball”
Reaper
OLBs
ILBs
DL

But it’s more of a “pieces of the puzzle” thing.
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Offline gumby_in_co

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Re: Amoeba 33
« Reply #109 on: August 30, 2019, 11:33:35 PM »
We got smacked, man. Don’t even know the score. 4th quarter we went 6-5 goal line and the casual observer would say it did better. We actually got them to a 3rd down. In reality, the opposing coach was about to start taking knees, but Mahonz convinced him to keep going so we could work. So instead, he subbed en masse and still scored.

What went wrong? We were out-mojo’d from start to finish. They hit us in the mouth and we folded. Both sides of the ball and special teams. No scheme or alignment is going to work if your players stand there and wait to get hit. We were a bag of nails and they were a bag of hammers. DP would be proud of them.

I’m not even going to watch film. I am not open to changing the defense. I’ll step down and wash bottles and someone else can take over if a scheme change is wanted.
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Offline ZACH

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Re: Amoeba 33
« Reply #110 on: August 31, 2019, 09:59:17 PM »
We got smacked, man. Don’t even know the score. 4th quarter we went 6-5 goal line and the casual observer would say it did better. We actually got them to a 3rd down. In reality, the opposing coach was about to start taking knees, but Mahonz convinced him to keep going so we could work. So instead, he subbed en masse and still scored.

What went wrong? We were out-mojo’d from start to finish. They hit us in the mouth and we folded. Both sides of the ball and special teams. No scheme or alignment is going to work if your players stand there and wait to get hit. We were a bag of nails and they were a bag of hammers. DP would be proud of them.

I’m not even going to watch film. I am not open to changing the defense. I’ll step down and wash bottles and someone else can take over if a scheme change is wanted.

Growing pains make it all worth while, keep at it.

Got get back with horsepower

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Offline CoachDP

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Re: Amoeba 33
« Reply #111 on: September 01, 2019, 12:40:01 AM »
[quote author=ZACH link=topic=28967.msg417944#msg417944 date=1567190526

If you got the kids that can come down hill and not have to worry much about run/pass/options. Just run near,far, and out thats awesome.



I'm starting to become convinced that everyone has the kids who can come down hill. If you saw our 2nd grade film from last year, you could see that we were far from a talented team. We had some "so so's" and a 2 big boys who could move, the rest were lost little kids out for recess. We coached the HELL out of them. Had no choice.

My 2 ILBs for example. No shit MPPs last year. Kept them on the field one at a time at NT. The tiniest one got the majority of the plays because the other one would take himself out of the game and cry on the sideline for a half. We didn't do anything special with them, but they were part of our team and that meant they hit and got hit . . . a lot. We knew that because we weren't super talented, we had to be ferocious. Sure, we saw improvement from these two by the end of the season, but they took the summer off and came back to us as hunter/killers. Still tiny, still slow, but damn, are they aggressive. The bigger of the two has an older brother by a year who pads up and plays scout for us in practice. I think he had a role in putting some starch in his little brother. Also big bro played Spring football and little bro padded up and practiced with him. Whatever. Similar stories with the rest of our D. "Okay" from a talent standpoint, but super aggressive and fearless.

I told Mahonz that I had a "long game" strategy with this type of defense. I've never felt like I had enough LBs and in my experience, they were born, not made. Then, I had my Amoeba experiment. Nothing but LBs. I then had a series of epiphanies. First was that telling a defender how to "take on" or "hit" a blocker was 180 degrees from pursuing the ball. Second was the idea that a player will never play like a linebacker if you never let him play like a linebacker. So what if I have EVERYONE play like a linebacker? I don't care if you're too big, too small, too slow, not athletic enough . . . whatever. Teach angles and let them figure out how to play football. Stop micromanaging and turn them loose. Yes, we had a ton of talent on that defense. However, I had 3 kids who started on that defense that . . . well . . . I was stuck with them. Too small for d-line, too slow for LB. Whatever. I treated them like the super fast, athletic and aggressive kids on that defense and held them to the same standard. I'll be damned if they didn't start making big plays by about the 3rd game. By the end of the season, they could have started at LB for any team I've ever coached.

Anyway, it just doesn't make sense to me anymore to say "Billy can't play LB", then put him over the C in a 4 point stance for a season and be surprised that Billy still can't play LB. At this stage, I tell Mahonz that for a few players, "they aren't ready yet", but they'll get trained like everyone else.

My next project will be turning average Joe's into "great running backs" by giving them the ball over and over.

Lar, we used Linebacker drills for our o-linemen when we taught them the 2-point stance.  In addition, our offensive linemen do tackling drills in their warmup, as we progress from hit/wrap/drive/take down to hit/drive.  Your post reminded me of something I posted a year ago, so I searched it and reposted it below:

What if Butkus, Nitschke, Nobis, Curtis, Singletary or any other great Linebacker were an offensive lineman?  How would you coach him?  What would you want him to do?  What do you think his psyche should be?  Unfortunately, too many youth coaches place their meekest and mildest on the O-Line, rep them against air, perhaps try to teach them to lock-out a defender who pushes past them with a simple over/under arm sweep, instead of coaching them with an approach as if they are the biggest and the baddest.  Our O-Line gets lots of contact drills.  When I was at EWHS, we had special shirts made for a select group of O-Linemen (only 2 of them had the shirts).  We not only practiced separately from the rest of the team, lifted as a group, but also had an "O-Linemen Only" workout routine which was in addition to the team's regular workout.  Once in a while, one of the Backs or Linebackers wanted to join in to show that they were tough enough to participate in these drills.  But we sent them away.  Our drills were separate and only for an elite group.  Since I coached the O-Line, I brought sports drinks, protein bars and gummies for the O-Line only.  Other players asked for them, but I told them you had to be in an elite group to get them.  We had Backs wanting to play O-Line not just for the drinks or shirts, but to prove that they should also be in our elite group.

If they don't know how to fight, teach them.  If they don't know physicality, teach them.  If they don't know the fundamentals of blocking, teach them.  But too many coaches are afraid to teach them to fight, because they are afraid for them to fight.  Too many coaches won't teach them physicality, because they are afraid to teach it (or they think players just have it/just don't have it).  Too many coaches don't teach multiple blocking fundamentals because they're lucky if they know how to teach one of them.  But on game day, "Block Somebody" becomes their mantra.  I pity the kids who get blamed and aren't coached.


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