Author Topic: Amoeba 33  (Read 2282 times)

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Offline Wing-n-It

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Re: Amoeba 33
« Reply #75 on: August 30, 2019, 12:17:58 PM »
I don't think so, Robert.  First of all, Wedge can be stopped if you know how.  Lar and Mike do.  Secondly, there's double A-gap coverage (which I never do, on my d-line), but double A-gap coverage can give a Wedge fits.

--Dave
I was saying I would wedge just because its what we do. Our first play is a wedge, everyone knows it but its made to look like our jet sweep and off tackle left. We run that motion and play to see how the defense adjusts to motion from our WB.

I only get a gleam in my eye when someone puts a NT in front of my center to run wedge. Odd thing is a lot of youth coaches think the best thing to stop a wedge is the NT. until he gets run over by the line they are happy to put one there.

I do not think with his double A gappers I will have an easy day wedging their defense because they know how to stop wedges
Robert

2 Things my offense will always have is a Wing and a Wedge

Online CoachDP

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Re: Amoeba 33
« Reply #76 on: August 30, 2019, 12:28:38 PM »
I was saying I would wedge just because its what we do.

--Oh, I get that.  There's no play I like better.  Or run better.

Our first play is a wedge, everyone knows it but its made to look like our jet sweep and off tackle left. We run that motion and play to see how the defense adjusts to motion from our WB.

--If your first play is Wedge, then how does the defense know it looks like your jet sweep & off tackle?  Don't you have to set up Wedge by showing your jet sweep/off tackle first?

--Dave

"The Greater the Teacher, the More Powerful the Player."

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Offline gumby_in_co

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Re: Amoeba 33
« Reply #77 on: August 30, 2019, 12:34:31 PM »
DANG PICTURE IS TOO BIG!

--Dave

Download it and open it in the viewer of your choice and in the resolution of your choice.  ::)
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Re: Amoeba 33
« Reply #78 on: August 30, 2019, 12:46:12 PM »
Download it and sdft ft lk lmn wsedrf op cdvm cswqrt hyg bg kjh swdefrgthy jh cdvm cswqrt.

 ::)

--Dave
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The Mission Statement:
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Offline gumby_in_co

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Re: Amoeba 33
« Reply #79 on: August 30, 2019, 12:47:34 PM »
Do your front 6 "move" ?

Ill try n find the rob ryan clinic i saw when he was in dc. Static is dangerous with these "ghost" fronts he said.

Your lbs are super deep too, how does this fair against a generic off tackle or belly?

They do not. I stole Clark's spacing concept to so that at least 3 defenders have a shorter route to the POA on any running play, regardless of the POA. This, in theory, neutralizes the "fast guy" because we don't have to run as far as he does . . . even if he runs a perfect path.

Believe it or not, we crush off tackles and belly plays. So far offenses get away from their inside game very quickly. In the Spring 8th/9th grade season, we struggled early against a power team, but were playing timid and back pedaling. Once we started attacking, we stopped them in their tracks. After that game, we gave up 2 runs over 5 yards and on both runs, I had WRs playing the ILB positions (their Amoeba equivalent) because they were short on plays.

Why does it work when it obviously shouldn't?  Our LBs see the ball from depth very well and they attack the ball. If I line up a 5 tech with the idea of stuffing an off tackle play, he has to wait for the ball to get to him or penetrate. If he doesn't penetrate, he is playing into the offense's strength, which is to use leverage and numbers to move him.  If he does penetrate, it's a crap shoot. TFL or complete miss and he's out of the play.

Same situation with a 50 tech. He has about the same distance to run as the RB. Since he's filling from depth, he's very hard to block for an OT. If the OT sits, the offense loses it's power. If he hunts, he is opening lanes for the other LBs to exploit from 5 yards. I have a little guy who I am absolutely bursting with pride over. He's learned to slow play it. He sits at 5 until he sees the lane, then sprints downhill with reckless abandon. If he were 20lbs heavier, the league would create a new rule for him.

I guess it works for the same reasons KO coverage works when the KR runs inside.  See it. Kill it.
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Offline gumby_in_co

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Re: Amoeba 33
« Reply #80 on: August 30, 2019, 12:50:07 PM »
While I could poke holes in your big-split offense all day long, this thing looks like it has some teeth and I'm really interested to see what/why/how you get it to work.  I definitely think you're heading in the right direction and you may have developed the true facemelter.  (Not kidding.)  Shrink down your picture or send me an attachment so I can check out this thing.

--Dave (who feels like Lar just pulled up in my driveway driving a DB11.  Open the hood!  OPEN THE HOOD!)

Here you go.

https://docs.google.com/presentation/d/13T-aYgR2wFXjTTOr-ykYxGXhh3_PmftuVj0FFKogBi0/edit?usp=sharing
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Online CoachDP

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Offline gumby_in_co

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Re: Amoeba 33
« Reply #82 on: August 30, 2019, 01:01:20 PM »
I would wedge just because I always do but I don't look at that alignment and think "Oh yeah, wedge allll day"
And I wedge everything but I am not licking my chops

I would really try with my DC wing T to Attack off tackle left side of offense with a 23 Power call.

It looks like you are using what was given to you for players.

Good luck you two. I hate pictures as well.

Wedge is untested. In the 8/9th grade Spring, we played one team who wedged. They were not good, but we crushed it. We will play a 3rd grade team who "wedges" from UBSW, but I don't think they are very good. Their BB is VERY good. I think of it more as a BB draw.

Here's why I think it will work as well or better than anything else against wedge.
1) When I learned wedge from Jack and JJ, it was their doctrine that they PREFER a NT because it helps the fit and push. Having resistance helps the wedge stay together the same way a keystone works in an arch. Something about distributing force. Ask Mahonz. He's an architect. Anyway, with no resistance for the first 3 steps or so, the wedge is on their own.

2) Wedge is a "sell out" play. That is not meant as a slight in any way. You are selling out for vertical force. We will not play that game. We will have at least 6 defenders attacking the wedge from the flanks, where the wedge is most vulnerable.

3) Wedge often works because the defense is surprised. I love the wedge and used to run it all the time. I was always amazed how a defense could still be surprised the 10th time we ran it in a row. From 5 yards, you see it forming and might even pick up the exchange.

4) I can always cut the wedge. I reserve that option.

We shall see, but counter question:  Does a defense lining up in an 80 front discourage you from running wedge? If not, then how does the front even matter?

Opposing coaches make a lot of comments about our front. I think they assume we will stand still and wait for them to arrive at 5 yards.
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Re: Amoeba 33
« Reply #83 on: August 30, 2019, 01:04:04 PM »
I stole Clark's spacing concept to so that at least 3 defenders have a shorter route to the POA on any running play, regardless of the POA. This, in theory, neutralizes the "fast guy" because we don't have to run as far as he does . . . even if he runs a perfect path.

Yep.  This.  Agree.  You, me, Clark....are all agreed on this approach.

--Dave
"The Greater the Teacher, the More Powerful the Player."

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Offline gumby_in_co

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Re: Amoeba 33
« Reply #84 on: August 30, 2019, 01:05:58 PM »
I don't think so, Robert.  First of all, Wedge can be stopped if you know how.  Lar and Mike do.  Secondly, there's double A-gap coverage (which I never do, on my d-line), but double A-gap coverage can give a Wedge fits.

--Dave

Our double A is a sellout gimmick. I have a pair of DTs who are scary. The each can forklift a typical O-lineman on their own and put him in the QB's lap. Together? Against 1 guy? . . . . makes me shudder.

Double B is really our base. Mahonz talked me down off the ledge. That said, I will open the game tonight in double A. DTs have the instruction that if they are in double A, they are to both ABUSE the center. Last year, in game 1, this team fumbled the snap 20 times. No exaggeration. This was with my tiny root hoggers over the C. I will abuse that center until it is no longer effective or until someone calls social services. Then I will go to double B.
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Re: Amoeba 33
« Reply #85 on: August 30, 2019, 01:06:41 PM »
We shall see, but counter question:  Does a defense lining up in an 80 front discourage you from running wedge? If not, then how does the front even matter?

--Doesn't.  What matters is the type of Wedge we run.

Opposing coaches make a lot of comments about our front. I think they assume we will stand still and wait for them to arrive at 5 yards.

--Ha ha!  Lar is funny.

--Dave

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Offline gumby_in_co

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Re: Amoeba 33
« Reply #86 on: August 30, 2019, 01:07:17 PM »
My question is how many teams do they face with real rules?  And "block somebody" isn't a rule.


None, so far.
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Offline gumby_in_co

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Re: Amoeba 33
« Reply #87 on: August 30, 2019, 01:10:06 PM »
And if there's only 2 down linemen, does that make everyone else a 2nd-level defender?  If it does, then I like this matchup, defensively.  I haven't seen a youth team yet whose offensive line could consistently matchup with my 2nd level personnel.  (Which is why I hate zone blocking for youth ball.)

--Dave

Absolutely, yes. In our first scrimmage, we didn't have 2 DLs. Just a NT. We gave up 4 or 5 long TDs and another AC wanted me to scrap the whole thing. I thought we were very close. I watched film and I KNEW we were very close. Made a few personnel adjustments, revisited pursuit angles, and 5 days later shut that same team down. Lost track of Mojo score. Every other play brought out the EMTs.  ;)
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Offline gumby_in_co

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Re: Amoeba 33
« Reply #88 on: August 30, 2019, 01:12:42 PM »
And "block somebody" isn't a rule.


Blasphemor!!!
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Re: Amoeba 33
« Reply #89 on: August 30, 2019, 01:13:01 PM »
Our double A is a sellout gimmick. I have a pair of DTs who are scary. The each can forklift a typical O-lineman on their own and put him in the QB's lap. Together? Against 1 guy? . . . . makes me shudder.

--Okay, I get that.  It's like when we run Gauntlet for our DTs.  If they're used to shredding 20 guys in a Gauntlet, a simple double-team or one-on-one ain't going to make him blink.

Double B is really our base. Mahonz talked me down off the ledge. That said, I will open the game tonight in double A. DTs have the instruction that if they are in double A, they are to both ABUSE the center. Last year, in game 1, this team fumbled the snap 20 times.

--Then he stinks as a Center, and they already stick as a team.  You're going to whip that team, regardless of whether you beat down their Center, or not.

No exaggeration. This was with my tiny root hoggers over the C. I will abuse that center until it is no longer effective or until someone calls social services. Then I will go to double B.

--Okay, that's where we'll differ.  I'll leave their Center alone.  I get why you do what you do, but their Center doesn't bother me.  He can't score.  I concern my 11 guys with that dude that carries the rock.  I understand you're shutting them down before their dude even carries the rock, but against a top level team?  They'll have a real Center.  And we could hit him with sledge hammers and not phase him.  That's why he's their Center.

--Dave

« Last Edit: August 30, 2019, 01:15:02 PM by CoachDP »
"The Greater the Teacher, the More Powerful the Player."

The Mission Statement:
"I want to show any young man that he is far tougher than he thinks, that he can accomplish more than what he dreamed and that his work ethic will take him wherever he wants to go." #BattleReady newhope