Author Topic: Amoeba 33  (Read 2358 times)

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Offline Dimson

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Re: Amoeba 33
« Reply #90 on: August 30, 2019, 01:23:32 PM »
DANG PICTURE IS TOO BIG!

--Dave
Just download it and it isn't so big.

Offline gumby_in_co

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Re: Amoeba 33
« Reply #91 on: August 30, 2019, 01:28:39 PM »
--Okay, that's where we'll differ.  I'll leave their Center alone.  I get why you do what you do, but their Center doesn't bother me.  He can't score.  I concern my 11 guys with that dude that carries the rock.  I understand you're shutting them down before their dude even carries the rock, but against a top level team?  They'll have a real Center.  And we could hit him with sledge hammers and not phase him.  That's why he's their Center.

Which is why it's a sellout gimmick. This team has 3 or 4 above average players. Then they have 2 UNREAL players. One who can't be tackled and one who can't be blocked. They ran the table and won the championship. 2 in a row, I believe. Before I get started, I am a big fan of their HC. He knows what he's doing and he knows the deal. He readily admits it. So I'm not taking a dump on him.

Offensively, their success is based on getting #17 the ball cleanly. After that, it's the Barry Sanders show. Yeah, that's pretty much it. So, if we can go 2 series preventing #17 from ever getting a hand off, or cause and recover a fumble, I hope to give Mahonz' Beast a short field and go up 14-0. But as soon as we're not blowing up the play on the 2nd step, back to 33.

Another note on the DTs. They will abuse the C on the way to the ball. Our double A call is "11" and is the ONLY situation where I permit a defender to contact a player who does not have the ball. Gimmick.

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Offline CoachDP

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Re: Amoeba 33
« Reply #92 on: August 30, 2019, 01:28:48 PM »
I will abuse that center until it is no longer effective or until someone calls social services.

This is the type of football that lends itself to the defender engaging a blocker (ram, ram, ram) while the ball-carrier is running down the field, 60 yards away.  And as you know, I don't want my defense engaging/scraping/touching an offensive player unless it's the one carrying the football.

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Offline CoachDP

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Re: Amoeba 33
« Reply #93 on: August 30, 2019, 01:33:57 PM »
Offensively, their success is based on getting #17 the ball cleanly. After that, it's the Barry Sanders show. Yeah, that's pretty much it. So, if we can go 2 series preventing #17 from ever getting a hand off, or cause and recover a fumble, I hope to give Mahonz' Beast a short field and go up 14-0.

--Yeah, I get it.  Stop the show before the show even gets started.  That's what our torpedo and squeeze drills were all about for our MPR-gap shooters.  Let's cancel the show before it even starts.  Same methodology here; just a different way to accomplish it.  Ok, I'm with ya.

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Offline Dimson

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Re: Amoeba 33
« Reply #94 on: August 30, 2019, 01:36:24 PM »

I never thought of running gauntlet with DTs. I like it!

Offline CoachSugg

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Re: Amoeba 33
« Reply #95 on: August 30, 2019, 02:35:31 PM »
Ugh....  Every time I see some of Mike's it sends me down a rabbit hole and what ifs.  This is no different.

Oh how I could see this working out really well with my personnel....  Lots of athleticism to work with.

Mike and Lar are bad for my "Reputation"   8)
Kent Sugg
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Offline ZACH

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Re: Amoeba 33
« Reply #96 on: August 30, 2019, 02:42:06 PM »
They do not. I stole Clark's spacing concept to so that at least 3 defenders have a shorter route to the POA on any running play, regardless of the POA. This, in theory, neutralizes the "fast guy" because we don't have to run as far as he does . . . even if he runs a perfect path.

Believe it or not, we crush off tackles and belly plays. So far offenses get away from their inside game very quickly. In the Spring 8th/9th grade season, we struggled early against a power team, but were playing timid and back pedaling. Once we started attacking, we stopped them in their tracks. After that game, we gave up 2 runs over 5 yards and on both runs, I had WRs playing the ILB positions (their Amoeba equivalent) because they were short on plays.

Why does it work when it obviously shouldn't?  Our LBs see the ball from depth very well and they attack the ball. If I line up a 5 tech with the idea of stuffing an off tackle play, he has to wait for the ball to get to him or penetrate. If he doesn't penetrate, he is playing into the offense's strength, which is to use leverage and numbers to move him.  If he does penetrate, it's a crap shoot. TFL or complete miss and he's out of the play.

Same situation with a 50 tech. He has about the same distance to run as the RB. Since he's filling from depth, he's very hard to block for an OT. If the OT sits, the offense loses it's power. If he hunts, he is opening lanes for the other LBs to exploit from 5 yards. I have a little guy who I am absolutely bursting with pride over. He's learned to slow play it. He sits at 5 until he sees the lane, then sprints downhill with reckless abandon. If he were 20lbs heavier, the league would create a new rule for him.

I guess it works for the same reasons KO coverage works when the KR runs inside.  See it. Kill it.

I saw similiar things when i ran the ole "eagle" by Greasy Neale. I also had my lbs at arms length off the dline or 2 yards off the ball.

If you got the kids that can come down hill and not have to worry much about run/pass/options. Just run near,far, and out thats awesome.

I agree with DP. You have something here.
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Offline mahonz

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Re: Amoeba 33
« Reply #97 on: August 30, 2019, 02:43:31 PM »
Ugh....  Every time I see some of Mike's it sends me down a rabbit hole and what ifs.  This is no different.

Oh how I could see this working out really well with my personnel....  Lots of athleticism to work with.

Mike and Lar are bad for my "Reputation"   8)

LOL

This was Lar's total experiment last Spring with endless 8th and 9th grade talent and holy cow did it preform....even considering endless talent.

This is the Smurf version. We could use one of two more LB'r types for depth but I think we are pretty dialed in.

Tonight is the big test. If we hold them to 3 scores or less....it will be a success and we can build from there.  They scored 5 TD's on us....and everyone else last season.
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Offline tiger46

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Re: Amoeba 33
« Reply #98 on: August 30, 2019, 02:55:05 PM »
A few seasons ago, our 8u team ran Mahonz' Monster Offense.  We faced a team that lined up defensively like this the second time that they played us:


*****************************************F
*******************************S*******************S

*****************************B*****B*****B*****B*****B

***************************************T*N*T
*************************************X*T*0*G*T*T****Y
************************************H****Q*******Z
***************************************S

It worked better than I had expected. But, their coaches didn't do enough in teaching pursuit and tackling.  Our best play against it was our version of 'zone stretch'. Basically, we the O-line would line up with 1` splits and the entire team would run left or right(O-line climbing and looking for work; mostly just getting in the way of defenders.) and let the RB's find the running lanes.  That play worked pretty well against the defenses we faced that season.
« Last Edit: August 30, 2019, 09:13:23 PM by tiger46 »
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Offline CoachDP

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Re: Amoeba 33
« Reply #99 on: August 30, 2019, 03:00:36 PM »
Our best play against it was our version of 'zone stretch'.

Ya think?  For the life of me, I don’t understand that defensive alignment....

—Dave
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Offline gumby_in_co

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Re: Amoeba 33
« Reply #100 on: August 30, 2019, 03:14:31 PM »
This is the type of football that lends itself to the defender engaging a blocker (ram, ram, ram) while the ball-carrier is running down the field, 60 yards away.  And as you know, I don't want my defense engaging/scraping/touching an offensive player unless it's the one carrying the football.

--Dave

Agree 100%. I view it as a "dirty trick", but I'm certainly not above that to win a game. If it were 100% up to me, I'd back these guys off, but the super safety committee says that since they weigh more than a completely arbitrary limit, they must be on the LOS.
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Offline gumby_in_co

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Re: Amoeba 33
« Reply #101 on: August 30, 2019, 03:37:33 PM »
[quote author=ZACH link=topic=28967.msg417944#msg417944 date=1567190526

If you got the kids that can come down hill and not have to worry much about run/pass/options. Just run near,far, and out thats awesome.

[/quote]

I'm starting to become convinced that everyone has the kids who can come down hill. If you saw our 2nd grade film from last year, you could see that we were far from a talented team. We had some "so so's" and a 2 big boys who could move, the rest were lost little kids out for recess. We coached the HELL out of them. Had no choice.

My 2 ILBs for example. No shit MPPs last year. Kept them on the field one at a time at NT. The tiniest one got the majority of the plays because the other one would take himself out of the game and cry on the sideline for a half. We didn't do anything special with them, but they were part of our team and that meant they hit and got hit . . . a lot. We knew that because we weren't super talented, we had to be ferocious. Sure, we saw improvement from these two by the end of the season, but they took the summer off and came back to us as hunter/killers. Still tiny, still slow, but damn, are they aggressive. The bigger of the two has an older brother by a year who pads up and plays scout for us in practice. I think he had a role in putting some starch in his little brother. Also big bro played Spring football and little bro padded up and practiced with him. Whatever. Similar stories with the rest of our D. "Okay" from a talent standpoint, but super aggressive and fearless.

I told Mahonz that I had a "long game" strategy with this type of defense. I've never felt like I had enough LBs and in my experience, they were born, not made. Then, I had my Amoeba experiment. Nothing but LBs. I then had a series of epiphanies. First was that telling a defender how to "take on" or "hit" a blocker was 180 degrees from pursuing the ball. Second was the idea that a player will never play like a linebacker if you never let him play like a linebacker. So what if I have EVERYONE play like a linebacker? I don't care if you're too big, too small, too slow, not athletic enough . . . whatever. Teach angles and let them figure out how to play football. Stop micromanaging and turn them loose. Yes, we had a ton of talent on that defense. However, I had 3 kids who started on that defense that . . . well . . . I was stuck with them. Too small for d-line, too slow for LB. Whatever. I treated them like the super fast, athletic and aggressive kids on that defense and held them to the same standard. I'll be damned if they didn't start making big plays by about the 3rd game. By the end of the season, they could have started at LB for any team I've ever coached.

Anyway, it just doesn't make sense to me anymore to say "Billy can't play LB", then put him over the C in a 4 point stance for a season and be surprised that Billy still can't play LB. At this stage, I tell Mahonz that for a few players, "they aren't ready yet", but they'll get trained like everyone else.

My next project will be turning average Joe's into "great running backs" by giving them the ball over and over.
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Offline CoachSugg

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Re: Amoeba 33
« Reply #102 on: August 30, 2019, 03:41:47 PM »
Lar,

How would you rank the positions in order of placement (starting talent)?

Reaper
Dogs
CBs
OLBs
DTs
ILBs

Would be my guess.
Kent Sugg
Bridge Creek, OK

Offline CoachDP

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Re: Amoeba 33
« Reply #103 on: August 30, 2019, 04:03:04 PM »
If you got the kids First was that telling a defender how to "take on" or "hit" a blocker was 180 degrees from pursuing the ball.

Hello.

Second was the idea that a player will never play like a linebacker if you never let him play like a linebacker. So what if I have EVERYONE play like a linebacker?

Which is why we started doing Linebacker Drills with our O-Line, when we first went to the 2-point stance.

My next project will be turning average Joe's into "great running backs" by giving them the ball over and over.

Which is why my schemes have never been determined by my talent.

—Dave

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Offline CoachDP

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Re: Amoeba 33
« Reply #104 on: August 30, 2019, 04:08:13 PM »
Similar stories with the rest of our D. "Okay" from a talent standpoint, but super aggressive and fearless.

Which once again reiterates that talent is not needed for effort or intensity.

—Dave
"The Greater the Teacher, the More Powerful the Player."

The Mission Statement:
"I want to show any young man that he is far tougher than he thinks, that he can accomplish more than what he dreamed and that his work ethic will take him wherever he wants to go." #BattleReady newhope