Author Topic: How do you block wide DE on OZ to open side?  (Read 5058 times)

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Offline Vince148

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How do you block wide DE on OZ to open side?
« on: May 28, 2011, 08:31:26 AM »
Let's say that you have a wing-t type offensive alignment and the DE on the open side is very wide. If you're running OZ to the open side what would the PST do? Does he go after the wide DE or should he just pull out and look for a LBer? Would it be best to have the WB motion across the formation and block the DE?

How do you run OZ in this situation?

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Re: How do you block wide DE on OZ to open side?
« Reply #1 on: May 28, 2011, 10:36:05 AM »
a wide technique is and will make the tackle unless you have a staff that has no idea what they are doing. By definition if he is wide, he should be an athlete...maybe soft but an athlete at that.
3 step shuffle then block him like he was a 5 technique.
« Last Edit: May 28, 2011, 12:41:09 PM by zoezachary »
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Offline Michael

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Re: How do you block wide DE on OZ to open side?
« Reply #2 on: May 28, 2011, 10:45:30 AM »
I know for some teams, a Wide 9 puts the tackle in an automatic 2-point stance (an edge 2, with the big stagger), whether there's a TE or not.
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coach msl

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Re: How do you block wide DE on OZ to open side?
« Reply #3 on: May 28, 2011, 11:04:22 AM »
Vince,

Can you show us the rest of the defense?


......................................9...
.....x.......................................t...g...c...G...T...Y.......................................................................
.......................................................Q................W..................................................................
..............................................R.......F.....................................................................................

Offline Vince148

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Re: How do you block wide DE on OZ to open side?
« Reply #4 on: May 28, 2011, 11:49:54 AM »
Facing a GAM or like a 50 front

............................S
............................B...................C
..C........E.......V..V...V..V....B....E
X.................T..G..C..G..T..TE
...........................QB.............WB

....................HB...FB

OR

..........................S
...C.................B.......B..............C
.............E....V.......V......V..B....E
X.................T..G..C..G..T..TE
..........................QB...............WB

....................HB...FB

However, I am leaning toward doing this from shotgun...


............................B...................S...C
..C........E.......V..V...V..V....B....E
X.................T..G..C..G..T..TE
............................................WB.......FL

..........................QB...FB

OR

...C.................B.......B..............S....C
.............E....V.......V......V..B....E
X.................T..G..C..G..T..TE
............................................WB......FL

..........................QB...FB


Offline Dusty Ol Fart

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Re: How do you block wide DE on OZ to open side?
« Reply #5 on: May 28, 2011, 01:23:27 PM »
Personally speaking, this is a prime example of why you DONT run OZ to the open side.  You simply cannot account for the Wide 9 unless you Crack, Motion or Load.  IZ and OZ dont always get the double teams.   

HOWEVER!!   

If you come off with a stretch form of OZ blocking (everyone comes off at a 45 to playside, similar to Down Blocks) you can indeed run OZ and the OT can seal the Wide 9 with the back going under/ inside the seal.   

IMHO you're much better off running this was a Weak Counter and pulling the Guard or going IZ to that side.

 ;)
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Offline Michael

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Re: How do you block wide DE on OZ to open side?
« Reply #6 on: May 28, 2011, 01:32:47 PM »
Wisco runs Inside Zone, Power, and Pin & Pull for their run game.  He likes Pin & Pull for the outside stuff because it changes the match-ups from Inside Zone, and Outside Zone generally doesn't. 

They pull the tackle.  I think it ends up a bit like the Indianapolis stretch play, maybe, but maybe hits a little more inside (or less outside, anyway).  The comparison to Indy is just speculation on my part, though.  I'm not all that well-versed on either play.
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Offline Dusty Ol Fart

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Re: How do you block wide DE on OZ to open side?
« Reply #7 on: May 28, 2011, 01:50:57 PM »
Wisconsin is almost an exact duplicate of Nebraska under Milt Tenopir and Tom Osbourne.  Only real difference is that Wisconsin doesn't run the option.  There are many ways to account for the Wide 9, but extremely difficult to do OZ on weak side.  As diagrammed, this is an IZ play all the way simply because, once you take out the LB its mano e mano for the back if the Safety makes the right read!!  WOOT

Indy is indeed a pin and pull line but they run OZ to the strong side and allow the back to read.  Most of their game is IZ with the back cutting.  Indy's line is, like most ZONE teams, very athletic and "undersized" compared to a Power running teams where beef and brute strength are needed.   

Folks the biggest advantage to pro and college level is that they can look for kids that fit their schemes or those who they feel they can teach it to.  Our disadvantage is that we don't get that luxury, we have to teach everyone of them.  So, with this in mind, you have to know how (WHEN) to run using IZ, OZ against the various fronts and defensive formations.  You have to know that a play using OZ is a questionable call to the weak side because that Wide 9 is hard to account for.   

Furthermore, just because a team uses zone blocking principles, that does not mean that they do not have other methodology for blocking.  Nebraska, for example, used head up blocking for their ISO's and a guard pull for their counters, just like a normal I  or Single back team would.   

  :) 
 
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Offline Vince148

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Re: How do you block wide DE on OZ to open side?
« Reply #8 on: May 28, 2011, 02:04:17 PM »
In essence, the only type of play that could be run would be to leave the DE unblocked and run a speed option.

Offline Dusty Ol Fart

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Re: How do you block wide DE on OZ to open side?
« Reply #9 on: May 28, 2011, 02:14:19 PM »
In essence, the only type of play that could be run would be to leave the DE unblocked and run a speed option.

Absolutely not!  A Speed Option is not the only play you can run to the weak side.  Can you run it?  Certainly.  But as I stated, IZ to the weak side renders that Wide 9 useless as all he can do to effect the play is come from behind.  A simple Counter with the FB bending back weak side and the strong side guard pulling to take the Wide 9 out allows you to use IZ blocking for play side and still get that critter blocked.   Very simple and, if the guard wipes that guy out, its a race to the end zone.  With IZ I dont care about him at all with the counter I get him blocked.  Both plays are still to the defenses weak side and both plays will be effective.  If you add in the Speed Option you now have 3 plays to run weak side.   :D

I guess my question is why are you running OZ with a Wing-T?  Not that you can't but most Wing-T's don't use Zone concepts.  Just a curiosity on my part. 

« Last Edit: May 28, 2011, 02:17:45 PM by CoachShad »
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Offline Michael

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Re: How do you block wide DE on OZ to open side?
« Reply #10 on: May 28, 2011, 02:18:11 PM »
If the Wide 9 is the second guy from the sideline (and at our level he always is), we're hitting him with a back.
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Offline Vince148

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Re: How do you block wide DE on OZ to open side?
« Reply #11 on: May 28, 2011, 04:00:44 PM »
Absolutely not!  A Speed Option is not the only play you can run to the weak side.
I didn't mean the "only" play. I was just thinking that maybe it's all that I can run with an OZ blocking scheme other than jet.

Quote
I guess my question is why are you running OZ with a Wing-T?  Not that you can't but most Wing-T's don't use Zone concepts.  Just a curiosity on my part.
Just looking at a different wrinkle other than belly. Also, I may incorporate shotgun into this.

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Re: How do you block wide DE on OZ to open side?
« Reply #12 on: May 28, 2011, 04:57:17 PM »
if you try and run the ball outside the defensive, everybody is right you will never get that play. But then you are missing the point of running the zone play inside or outside. By alignment the ball should be  run inside the defensive end.
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Offline Dusty Ol Fart

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Re: How do you block wide DE on OZ to open side?
« Reply #13 on: May 28, 2011, 05:03:46 PM »
if you try and run the ball outside the defensive, everybody is right you will never get that play. But then you are missing the point of running the zone play inside or outside. By alignment the ball should be  run inside the defensive end.

 :D ;D :) 8) !!!!
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Re: How do you block wide DE on OZ to open side?
« Reply #14 on: May 28, 2011, 05:40:22 PM »
You can run it weak,  the footwork is a little different for the tackle but it can done, the oline coach for the saints talks about this in either 09 or 10 cool clinic dvd or manual.
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