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Author Topic: Help with 3x1 concepts  (Read 664 times)

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Offline joshv155

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Help with 3x1 concepts
« on: October 02, 2018, 01:02:24 PM »
Coaches -

In a couple of weeks we are playing a tough team that we have struggled running against/scoring much over the past few years. We are in a 13-14 year old age bracket. This team runs a 6-2 where there DE's have no coverage responsibility that I have seen. They play man to man. I am looking for some advice and help on 2-3 concepts for the trips side that are man beaters and fall in the quick game category. I am reading through the quick game thread to get some ideas as well. Also looking for advice on how to block their 6 man front. Their right 4/5 tech is very quick off the ball and is a very good pass rusher. Interior DT's are average. Left 4/5 tech is just a step below his counterpart on the other side.

I wanted to use the 3x1 formation to attack their corner on the 1 side. He will be left all alone and play 5-6 yards off. The play slightly outside leverage with the corners hips/eyes on the QB. We have been working on quick screens, hitches, slants and fades. My QB has a good arm and is the most athletic kid on the team.

What is the spacing coaches normally use for the trips side receivers ? What about the single side receiver ? We have had him 12 yards from the tackle, trying to keep a consistent alignment. We don't practice on a lined field with hashes/numbers so we use steps (yards) to align.

We expect them to line up like this vs. our 3x1:



                                                                                      S
                                                                           
                                      C                                   LB              LB       C           
                                                                   E T N    N T E
                                        X                           T G C G T                  Z
                                                                                       Y     S
                                                                       R  Q   

Corner on our left is the weaker of the two.Corner on our right has great hands and is their #1 WR. Not super aggressive on D though. Safety is a really good athlete and defender.  We want to attack left a ton, our run game plan I have listed below but could use some advice on that too.

How would you pass block this front ? They will send the LB through an A gap to get more pressure at times. Turns into 7 vs. 6 and we can't get the DE's. Thought of short motioning Y inside to get the trips side DE when we know we are throwing to the 1 side.

Concepts we have in for trips side are:

Slant/Wheel (Y runs the wheel)
Fade/Out (Y runs five yard out)
Bubble/Fade/Fin (Outside in. Throw the screen if the Corner sits or back peddles, throw the fade, that is starts by aiming at the outside shoulder of the man over Z, if the corner comes up for the bubble)
Drive (S on the ball, Z off. Z motions inside of Y and runs a shallow cross, Y a 10 yard dig and S a fade)


1 WR Side we run: hitch, slant, bubble, fade. Would you add anything to that ?


Run game wise we have QB off tackle with R tacking the E, Q reading his block. Same QB off tackle but we fast motion Y across and he kicks out the E with R now leading through, Speed option (both sides but plan on running it to the 1 WR side), QB ISO where we cross block the T/N, R cheats up a little and lead blocks, HB slip screen to 1 WR side. We can go under center and wedge them if the LB is playing off. Any other run ideas ?


Toyed with this formation as I saw a team go empty against them. Want to pull the LB out.


                                                                           S
 
                                   C                                            LB   LB      C     
                                                          E T N    N T   E
                                      X                     T G C G T Y
                                                                                   R    S    Z
                                                                   Q         

We could slide away from Y in order to pick up the front. Also that of widening the guards splits, C/G double one of the N's and run the QB up the middle. UC wedge, quick passes to X.

Hoping to out formation this team. They don't have anyone assigned to the QB.

Any help on formations, pass blocking assignments, a couple of quick game concepts and any other advice would be appreciated.

I've thought about trying the read option focusing on the backside (1 WR side) DE, but have not run that before. Can someone point me to a starting place to research....when I google it there are thousands of opinions. These are 8th graders and we have 3 weeks to get it down while practicing everything else. But it seems like it is a good play to isolate the DE.

Apologize for the long post but wanted to get all as much info out as I could for responses. Thanks !     
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Offline ZACH

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Re: Help with 3x1 concepts
« Reply #1 on: October 02, 2018, 01:50:55 PM »
You want to iso a corner in a 62.

If you think theyll adjust like your drawings great.  Other wise, i think route calling is more important.

For example...ide "shoot" my 1v1 and throw or have pre called routes based on the coverage.

I dont see the advantage by changing ao much for 1 match up, howeveelr if you do. Ide consider shooting
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Offline blockandtackle

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Re: Help with 3x1 concepts
« Reply #2 on: October 02, 2018, 02:22:13 PM »
You've got a lot already.  Anything I'd add would depend on my QB and the pass protection schemes I use.

One thing I do like is sprinting out in Trips, both to the strong side (I like a Flood concept: #1 on streak, #2 on a deep out, #3 on a deeper out with #1 backside on a post) and to the weak side when they try to single cover the isolated WR (send #1 on a 10 yard out or an 18 yard comeback--these are always open).  The sprint out to the weakside can be money because teams usually expect it to the strongside and that WR is on an island.

2 things that make sprint outs easier:

1.  Consistent backside rules for the WRs.  #1 backside runs a post, #2 backside runs a drag, #3 backside runs a shallow cross.  This carries over across single WR on the backside to 3 WRs on the backside.  Tag the play with some keyword when you want your QB looking back there.

2.  Sprint Out protection.  What I like is the run and shoot full slide sprint out protection.  Playside C, G, and T basically reach their playside gaps and block playside A, B, and C, respectively.  Backside will work through their playside gap and hinge back if nothing's showing.  RB goes playside to pick up a potential hot rusher through #2 or help the T with a tough DE.

As far as a man beater, it's hard to beat good ol' Mesh or the Run and Shoot Switch concept.  Switch can be done with #1 and #2 to the Trips side switching and rubbing each other--#2 down the sideline is almost always wide open and it's a TD if you complete.

I also LOVE 4 Verts from Trips as a dropback pass.

Offline spidermac

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Re: Help with 3x1 concepts
« Reply #3 on: October 02, 2018, 02:36:20 PM »
Just looking at your diagrams, I read it as middle of the field open...your X should be wide open on anything you run to the middle of the field with him. In your single back set...get your back to peel to the side away from the Trips...have you X run something to clear and dump it to him...
None of them suck, they just haven't found what the kid is good at yet.

Offline joshv155

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Re: Help with 3x1 concepts
« Reply #4 on: October 02, 2018, 03:59:42 PM »
You want to iso a corner in a 62.

If you think theyll adjust like your drawings great.  Other wise, i think route calling is more important.

For example...ide "shoot" my 1v1 and throw or have pre called routes based on the coverage.

I dont see the advantage by changing ao much for 1 match up, howeveelr if you do. Ide consider shooting

Meaning a shoot route with a back  to the #1 WR side ?

We aren't changing too much. We have been practicing and running the 3x1 for several weeks. We play an out of league team this week that doesn't have any bearing on our playoff standings. We plan to run mainly what I have posted already and work out the bugs where need be.
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Offline joshv155

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Re: Help with 3x1 concepts
« Reply #5 on: October 02, 2018, 04:02:26 PM »
Couple of photos of them vs. other teams. Nothing vs. 3x1 that we have scouted yet. Bottom picture vs. empty there are only 10 dudes on the field. I wasn't there, we had a HS kid video for us, so I don't know if they have a deep safety.
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Offline MHcoach

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Re: Help with 3x1 concepts
« Reply #6 on: October 02, 2018, 07:50:10 PM »
Josh

First off the semantics need to be cleared up. 6-2 is not what this is. 6-2 is an 8 man box this is a 7 man box. I would call it a 6-1 monster cover 0. I can even see their coaches calling it a 4-3 full dog.

Ok, that aside they are in Cover 0.

Do the flip anyone?

14 looks to be the monster or SS depending on the terminology. Either way I will bet he is their dewd.

Does he flip sides?

Do they stay C0 vs trips?

What type of protection will you use against a 7 man rush?

This is what will really determine the routes & concepts you can use.

Just looking at it I get excited because we never allow anyone to C0 against us & survive.

I have plenty of ideas if you want call.

Joe
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Offline joshv155

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Re: Help with 3x1 concepts
« Reply #7 on: October 03, 2018, 02:20:49 PM »
Josh

Quote
First off the semantics need to be cleared up. 6-2 is not what this is. 6-2 is an 8 man box this is a 7 man box. I would call it a 6-1 monster cover 0. I can even see their coaches calling it a 4-3 full dog.

I called it a 6-2 because if we have a 21 personnel group they have 2 LB's. Always the 6 man front. They blitz both LB's just about every play. I see your meaning though.



Quote
Do the flip anyone?

14 looks to be the monster or SS depending on the terminology. Either way I will bet he is their dewd.

Does he flip sides?

I think you mean 15, but yes he is a dude. He takes #2 on the defensive left OR a TE. It looks like TE is his first responsibility. So he will flip, but no one else does.

#9 is their left corner and their best WR. Really good hands. #6 is there best DE and he is on the left, #19 is there left DT and he is a dude. They stack their left side.

But back to your original questions. They don't flip anyone but #15, their safety or Monster.


Quote
Do they stay C0 vs trips?

Yes

Quote
What type of protection will you use against a 7 man rush?

Need help with this. I'll call instead of typing a ton

Quote
This is what will really determine the routes & concepts you can use.

Just looking at it I get excited because we never allow anyone to C0 against us & survive.

I have plenty of ideas if you want call.

Calling soon !

Joe
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Offline Seabass

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Re: Help with 3x1 concepts
« Reply #8 on: October 04, 2018, 12:07:53 AM »
Do you normally play out of empty?

Offline joshv155

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Re: Help with 3x1 concepts
« Reply #9 on: October 04, 2018, 12:36:32 AM »
Do you normally play out of empty?

Our base has been DCWT but we have a 3x1 package we utilize. Empty, not so much. We have used it in the past but donít base out of it and itís dependent on who we are playing.
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Offline Seabass

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Re: Help with 3x1 concepts
« Reply #10 on: October 04, 2018, 04:40:45 PM »
I asked because your 3x1 diagram had a TE and no back.

Offline joshv155

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Re: Help with 3x1 concepts
« Reply #11 on: October 04, 2018, 07:21:31 PM »
I asked because your 3x1 diagram had a TE and no back.

Was an idea I had to force them to move both their ILBís out. Even when we are in 3x1 they have 7 dudes rushing to our 6 blockers. The goal is to force them to number up then widen our inside line splits some and run an interior trap with my QB. Also pull a guard to the weak side, kick out the end and run our QB off tackle.
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Offline blockandtackle

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Re: Help with 3x1 concepts
« Reply #12 on: October 05, 2018, 11:44:12 AM »
One route combo that looks good here is #1 on a post, #2 on a curl, #3 on a wheel.  Also, double posts with #3 on a wheel would really stress that DE.

Just a straight up bubble screen to the Trips looks great, too.

I'd be tempted to line up and run a 3-in-1 RPO package here over and over again until they adjust:
Bubble screen to the Trips
Slant or Fin or Fade with a flare by the back to the single WR side (whichever route your QB throws best)
QB Trap or QB Dive up the middle.

If you're QB's not a good runner, you could have the RB on the Trap or Dive while the WR runs a true isolation route.  Just call the package with 1 word and give the QB a signal where to go with the ball presnap, because that's literally the only thing that would change.

Tunnel screen to the single WR would also be nice.
« Last Edit: October 05, 2018, 11:46:59 AM by blockandtackle »

Offline joshv155

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Re: Help with 3x1 concepts
« Reply #13 on: October 05, 2018, 05:00:53 PM »
One route combo that looks good here is #1 on a post, #2 on a curl, #3 on a wheel.  Also, double posts with #3 on a wheel would really stress that DE.

Just a straight up bubble screen to the Trips looks great, too.

I'd be tempted to line up and run a 3-in-1 RPO package here over and over again until they adjust:
Bubble screen to the Trips
Slant or Fin or Fade with a flare by the back to the single WR side (whichever route your QB throws best)
QB Trap or QB Dive up the middle.

If you're QB's not a good runner, you could have the RB on the Trap or Dive while the WR runs a true isolation route.  Just call the package with 1 word and give the QB a signal where to go with the ball presnap, because that's literally the only thing that would change.

Tunnel screen to the single WR would also be nice.

My QB is our best overall runner.

We have tunnel in to the 1 side. We have a rollout type RPO to the 1 side. HB runs a shoot route aiming right at the DEís outside shoulder then to the flat. QB rolls same side while #1 WR runs a fade. DE takes QB he dumps it off to the HB. If he takes the HB QB runs.

We put a speed option in to the 1 side WR as well. Straight off tackle run as well with RB blocking DE, QB cutting off his block.

We are going to pick on the #1 side DE all day and make him wrong whatever he does.
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Offline Coach Smith

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Re: Help with 3x1 concepts
« Reply #14 on: January 09, 2019, 02:35:09 PM »
Looking back and i was curious what was the result of this game was?
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