Author Topic: Beast - Platinum Edition  (Read 2729 times)

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Offline mahonz

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Re: Beast - Platinum Edition
« Reply #15 on: April 06, 2018, 04:50:45 PM »
Do you think he can make OC understand? I can't.

I dont think our OC understands much of anything anymore except his new GF.  :-\
Collect moments, not wins.

Offline Bob Goodman

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Re: Beast - Platinum Edition
« Reply #16 on: April 07, 2018, 02:47:56 PM »
Last week, we installed "Cowboy", which is the side saddle blocking back under center. He still has the kick out block on blast. I had some issues with the blocking path of both backs, but it was easily fixed. I just had them reverse their banana path.
By "reverse", do you mean that instead of starting forward & flattening out, they start flat & bend forward?

Some day I'd like to run a buck lateral series with a T as the link man.  It's not unprecedented, I've read.

Offline Bob Goodman

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Re: Beast - Platinum Edition
« Reply #17 on: April 07, 2018, 02:56:10 PM »
Funny....Fredricks and I were standing on the goal line during Team when you were working on your jets. He asked if he should blitz those ridiculous A Gap splits with his Mike. It old him sure....and be sure to jump the motion. Two plays later when your QB scored he turned to me and said...ah...I get it.

Lesson learned.....NEVER blitz a mega splits team. They always have an answer and its usually a TD. The Defense really must sit in base and cover space.
But as they cover space, OL can cover space too and get to them.

If you'll recall, not long ago I was thinking keyboard-wise about how to defeat my own tactic of releasing outer OL to block FBI.  The drill I ran some years ago I concluded was unrealistic unless a MLB sat back there a while.  I gathered that the way to defeat a FBI assignment was for a LB to fill quickly, so the releasing OL could never get to him in time -- even if the distance were short enough, there'd be other OL & DL in the way by the time the LB plugged the hole.

But now you're saying that with OL widely spread, LBs should "cover space"?  How do they do that as play develops?

Offline mahonz

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Re: Beast - Platinum Edition
« Reply #18 on: April 07, 2018, 07:49:28 PM »
But as they cover space, OL can cover space too and get to them.

If you'll recall, not long ago I was thinking keyboard-wise about how to defeat my own tactic of releasing outer OL to block FBI.  The drill I ran some years ago I concluded was unrealistic unless a MLB sat back there a while.  I gathered that the way to defeat a FBI assignment was for a LB to fill quickly, so the releasing OL could never get to him in time -- even if the distance were short enough, there'd be other OL & DL in the way by the time the LB plugged the hole.

But now you're saying that with OL widely spread, LBs should "cover space"?  How do they do that as play develops?

If your box is gap control then every player is covering more space meaning there are bigger creases for the RB's. If you play your DL as occupiers....well...its impossible unless you play a 6 man front. Still flowing hard to fill works against you because the cut back alleys are....mega.

Therefore if you blitz one position in your box....yes you are filling a gap but you are also stressing the second level to cover even more space.

The OL isnt really covering space. They are either On or Gap or running interference to the LB'r. The latter takes some time to get good at. Now a day we have developed 3 or 4 climbers that really get after LB'rs.
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Offline Bob Goodman

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Re: Beast - Platinum Edition
« Reply #19 on: April 08, 2018, 12:31:20 PM »
The OL isnt really covering space.
I meant it like people say, "covering ground", i.e. moving.  Like, if they have time to get there while the LB has to watch some space, he's dead meat. That's why in my drill to release an OL to block FBI, the only collisions I allowed were with an OLB or CB trying to cross the blocker's face; everything else was supposed to be touch only, because it was such a setup.

I'm trying to think about this from both sides.  In the case of the defense, I'm trying to figure how a LB can be made less of a sitting duck.  With splits as wide as you're discussing, that looks like a tough job if the LB doesn't pick a gap to either shoot at the snap or to defend immediately after it.

Offline mahonz

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Re: Beast - Platinum Edition
« Reply #20 on: April 08, 2018, 01:10:09 PM »
I meant it like people say, "covering ground", i.e. moving.  Like, if they have time to get there while the LB has to watch some space, he's dead meat. That's why in my drill to release an OL to block FBI, the only collisions I allowed were with an OLB or CB trying to cross the blocker's face; everything else was supposed to be touch only, because it was such a setup.

I'm trying to think about this from both sides.  In the case of the defense, I'm trying to figure how a LB can be made less of a sitting duck.  With splits as wide as you're discussing, that looks like a tough job if the LB doesn't pick a gap to either shoot at the snap or to defend immediately after it.

What really hurts us is quality LB'rs that sit then spike. There are a few teams we played on a regular basis that figured this out. Align a bit deeper sit and read then attack. More times than not they come in behind our blocking at an angle untouched.

The further the OL has to travel to a LB'r the less effective they become and why blitzing via delay or walk up actually helps the OLM.

Its goes back to my Defensive thoery of less is more vs the unusual. So many think they need to bring the house and overwhelm. Nope. Sit in base...relax...then play fast.
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Offline Coach Correa

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Re: Beast - Platinum Edition
« Reply #21 on: April 08, 2018, 08:13:36 PM »
What really hurts us is quality LB'rs that sit then spike. There are a few teams we played on a regular basis that figured this out. Align a bit deeper sit and read then attack. More times than not they come in behind our blocking at an angle untouched.

The further the OL has to travel to a LB'r the less effective they become and why blitzing via delay or walk up actually helps the OLM.

Its goes back to my Defensive thoery of less is more vs the unusual. So many think they need to bring the house and overwhelm. Nope. Sit in base...relax...then play fast.
I've always fell those read and react Defenses were always hardest to attack. Especially if there were gap sound and played down hill...
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Offline gumby_in_co

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Re: Beast - Platinum Edition
« Reply #22 on: April 10, 2018, 03:46:30 PM »
I promised good, bad and ugly. Well, here's fugly. Last play of the game on their 4 yard line. First time running this against live bodies:

https://drive.google.com/open?id=1y79Z_BW1S493yDZqOVwJsLRSZFAsL1d2

Gross.

Hopefully much more to share after Saturday.
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Offline davecisar

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Re: Beast - Platinum Edition
« Reply #23 on: April 10, 2018, 04:01:16 PM »
Going from 1 ball exchange to 3 is ONE of the reasons I went away from Buck lateral back in 2006
ANother- ANY penetration kills the play
However beautiful the strategy, you should occasionally look at the results.

Winston Churchill

Offline gumby_in_co

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Re: Beast - Platinum Edition
« Reply #24 on: April 10, 2018, 06:06:12 PM »
Going from 1 ball exchange to 3 is ONE of the reasons I went away from Buck lateral back in 2006
ANother- ANY penetration kills the play

But you coached until 2006.  ;)

Yeah, mega splits might kill buck lateral in a hurry, but we’ll find out one way or another. As I was daring the OC to run it, Mahonz said, “Somebody is going to score on this play. Them or us.”
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Offline davecisar

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Re: Beast - Platinum Edition
« Reply #25 on: April 10, 2018, 07:13:47 PM »
I coach now
I dumped buck lateral 12 years ago after giving it several years of trial with several different teams
Risk reward sucks on it
However beautiful the strategy, you should occasionally look at the results.

Winston Churchill

Offline gumby_in_co

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Re: Beast - Platinum Edition
« Reply #26 on: April 11, 2018, 08:30:51 PM »
I coach now
I dumped buck lateral 12 years ago after giving it several years of trial with several different teams
Risk reward sucks on it

Oops. Meant to say "you coached it until 2006".

We saw some penetration problems on Tuesday. Pretty sure we addressed that adequately.
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Offline davecisar

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Re: Beast - Platinum Edition
« Reply #27 on: April 12, 2018, 08:22:30 AM »
Oops. Meant to say "you coached it until 2006".

We saw some penetration problems on Tuesday. Pretty sure we addressed that adequately.

Yep

Good luck

I used it for just 4 years- and didnt for the last 12 years
3 ball exchanges and then of course the cant have any penetration thing- even with no splits made it an absolute no go for me- lots of better places to invest practice time and plays etc
However beautiful the strategy, you should occasionally look at the results.

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Offline mahonz

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Re: Beast - Platinum Edition
« Reply #28 on: April 12, 2018, 05:19:02 PM »
Im liking this Buck lateral thing just to see. With a group of talented 8th Graders....why not.

With Smurfs...yah probably not a great idea.

Im just tired of watching our Teams over the years obliterate opponents running Beast. Time to create the Platinum Edition just to see what shakes out. I think after this week we will be close. Or not... and everything goes to the shredder.  :P
Collect moments, not wins.

Offline davecisar

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Re: Beast - Platinum Edition
« Reply #29 on: April 12, 2018, 06:47:13 PM »
Im liking this Buck lateral thing just to see. With a group of talented 8th Graders....why not.

With Smurfs...yah probably not a great idea.

Im just tired of watching our Teams over the years obliterate opponents running Beast. Time to create the Platinum Edition just to see what shakes out. I think after this week we will be close. Or not... and everything goes to the shredder.  :P

Just remember what a team of Elite kids- with no MPRs can do in the 8th grade isnt equal to what the potential of most teams can do


That's why I never roll out something that worked for me for one year- with one team- because that one team may be a very unique group.
However beautiful the strategy, you should occasionally look at the results.

Winston Churchill