Author Topic: TE or no TE in Prostyle  (Read 8370 times)

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Offline MHcoach

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Re: TE or no TE in Prostyle
« Reply #30 on: May 28, 2016, 10:29:50 AM »
   Iron

I know how challenge it can be at a small private school. How many coaches do you have? When I was at LMP we only had 3. BTW LMP just named a new HC.

Joe
"Champions behave like champions before they're champions: they have a winning standard of performance before they are winners"
Bill Walsh

Offline PSLCOACHROB

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Re: TE or no TE in Prostyle
« Reply #31 on: May 28, 2016, 07:46:42 PM »
Thoughts on using both a te and h? Drawing a few things up against youth defenses we commonly see and I like it.

Offline CoachSugg

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Re: TE or no TE in Prostyle
« Reply #32 on: May 28, 2016, 10:17:29 PM »
Thoughts on using both a te and h? Drawing a few things up against youth defenses we commonly see and I like it.

That's where I'm leaning.

Base formation of an SE and H on left TE and Z on right.  Will motion H into numerous formations.
Kent Sugg
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Offline PSLCOACHROB

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Re: TE or no TE in Prostyle
« Reply #33 on: May 29, 2016, 11:41:34 AM »
I love the te in youth because it is easy to get them to be completely uncovered. With an H I think they will be even more ignored. Many defenses will also align run strength the the te and I think an H can really screw with that. This is all probably really obvious to those that are familiar to H backs but I have never had an offense with one. I think if I was ever to coach again and  to run an offense I would really consider running a single back/pro style offense with a te and an H.

Offline MHcoach

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Re: TE or no TE in Prostyle
« Reply #34 on: May 29, 2016, 12:06:57 PM »
R

Here's the way to think of it. It's almost Spread DW. We found in Youth our base formation being what I call King allowed us much more variety with what we could do. Remember we had large splits, so it allowed us to stretch the Defense & there was no true strong side. Defenses had to either pick their poison or play us straight up.

Those double HBacks also gave us an additional run threat.

Joe
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Bill Walsh

Offline PSLCOACHROB

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Re: TE or no TE in Prostyle
« Reply #35 on: May 29, 2016, 12:17:47 PM »
I have almost always been a tight split guy. I forget sometimes how larger splits changes the way a defense plays.
« Last Edit: May 29, 2016, 12:25:52 PM by PSLCOACHROB »

Offline Dimson

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Re: TE or no TE in Prostyle
« Reply #36 on: May 29, 2016, 12:36:38 PM »
   Iron

I know how challenge it can be at a small private school. How many coaches do you have? When I was at LMP we only had 3. BTW LMP just named a new HC.

Joe

LMP has football again?

Offline MHcoach

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Re: TE or no TE in Prostyle
« Reply #37 on: May 29, 2016, 12:39:51 PM »
C

Last 2 years. The baseball coach from Edgewater was the HC now they just hired another one.

Joe
"Champions behave like champions before they're champions: they have a winning standard of performance before they are winners"
Bill Walsh

Offline Dimson

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Re: TE or no TE in Prostyle
« Reply #38 on: May 29, 2016, 01:07:10 PM »
C

Last 2 years. The baseball coach from Edgewater was the HC now they just hired another one.

Joe

Oh ok. Would you ever go back if they offered you the HC spot?

Offline MHcoach

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Re: TE or no TE in Prostyle
« Reply #39 on: May 29, 2016, 01:19:14 PM »
R

Someone posted clinic notes from the 60's. It was on the Full house T, it gave the splits as 3'. That was the offense I ran when I played in HS. I could never understand tighter splits. I always joke with DC about playing in a shoe box. Whenever we saw teams toe to toe we knew we would crush them. It wasn't untill the UBSW & the DWDT that we saw any toe to toe teams that were any good.

Pro Style to me was always 21 personnel & Split Backs. The Redskins in the 80's were really the pioneers of the ECO. The modern offense if you read the PP really is a combination of Wing T principles & the ECO. IMHO the real key to being successful in Youth Football is to be multiple & to allow each team to do what it does best. I always want the ability to run my best play several different ways. When you look at DC's UBSW that is what he does. It's really the same formula with different ingredients.

IMHO the mistake most Youth Coaches make is they don't adjust the Splits & depth's of the backs to fit their personnel. Lining a 10 y/o TB up at 7yds deep is crazy. When he hits the LOS the blocking has already been compromised. Having a SE at 19 yds when the QB can't throw Smoke but 14 yds is useless. These are the real issues many Youth Coaches have.

Another issue is teaching good stances & blocking fundamentals. There are coaches here that can tell you 19 different routes & combinations, but their OLine couldn't block a paper cut out. Instead learning how to teach blocking they are looking for the next great offense.

Joe
"Champions behave like champions before they're champions: they have a winning standard of performance before they are winners"
Bill Walsh

Offline MHcoach

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Re: TE or no TE in Prostyle
« Reply #40 on: May 29, 2016, 01:20:36 PM »
Oh ok. Would you ever go back if they offered you the HC spot?
C

Pay me enough I would. Otherwise it's very difficult to go from coaching big time ball back to small ball & all the problems that come with it.

Joe
"Champions behave like champions before they're champions: they have a winning standard of performance before they are winners"
Bill Walsh

Offline Dimson

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Re: TE or no TE in Prostyle
« Reply #41 on: May 29, 2016, 03:09:19 PM »
C

Pay me enough I would. Otherwise it's very difficult to go from coaching big time ball back to small ball & all the problems that come with it.

Joe

You do have it pretty sweet at LMH.

Offline PSLCOACHROB

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Re: TE or no TE in Prostyle
« Reply #42 on: May 29, 2016, 10:56:30 PM »
R

Someone posted clinic notes from the 60's. It was on the Full house T, it gave the splits as 3'. That was the offense I ran when I played in HS. I could never understand tighter splits. I always joke with DC about playing in a shoe box. Whenever we saw teams toe to toe we knew we would crush them. It wasn't untill the UBSW & the DWDT that we saw any toe to toe teams that were any good.

Pro Style to me was always 21 personnel & Split Backs. The Redskins in the 80's were really the pioneers of the ECO. The modern offense if you read the PP really is a combination of Wing T principles & the ECO. IMHO the real key to being successful in Youth Football is to be multiple & to allow each team to do what it does best. I always want the ability to run my best play several different ways. When you look at DC's UBSW that is what he does. It's really the same formula with different ingredients.

IMHO the mistake most Youth Coaches make is they don't adjust the Splits & depth's of the backs to fit their personnel. Lining a 10 y/o TB up at 7yds deep is crazy. When he hits the LOS the blocking has already been compromised. Having a SE at 19 yds when the QB can't throw Smoke but 14 yds is useless. These are the real issues many Youth Coaches have.

Another issue is teaching good stances & blocking fundamentals. There are coaches here that can tell you 19 different routes & combinations, but their OLine couldn't block a paper cut out. Instead learning how to teach blocking they are looking for the next great offense.

Joe

I was talking today about how a coach I know didn't understand spacing with the wr and qb and how of course in his mind it was the qbs fault.

When Jeff first went from a wing t team(not entirely but basically) to a zero split sw team I scratched my head. Then when I understood what it was doing to the defense the light bulb damn near blew up. Honestly though, I'm a bit bored with it. Not the sw or dw, just the whole zero splits thing.

I'm with you on fundies. I enjoy coaching that part of the game much more anyway, But many youth headers just don't get it. And many talk the talk but fall flat on their face when it comes to walking. I am by no means a great x's and o's guy(I can hold my own against most youth coaches though) but I do pride myself on being able to teach fundies.

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Re: TE or no TE in Prostyle
« Reply #43 on: May 30, 2016, 05:51:47 PM »
I was talking today about how a coach I know didn't understand spacing with the wr and qb and how of course in his mind it was the qbs fault.

When Jeff first went from a wing t team(not entirely but basically) to a zero split sw team I scratched my head. Then when I understood what it was doing to the defense the light bulb damn near blew up. Honestly though, I'm a bit bored with it. Not the sw or dw, just the whole zero splits thing.

I'm with you on fundies. I enjoy coaching that part of the game much more anyway, But many youth headers just don't get it. And many talk the talk but fall flat on their face when it comes to walking. I am by no means a great x's and o's guy(I can hold my own against most youth coaches though) but I do pride myself on being able to teach fundies.
I will chime in here coming from a guy that lived by 2 ft splits for 14 season's prior to last season and averaged 36 ppg over that time using the standard two ft split. For me i feel I can accomplish all the same thing's with angle blocking aka GAP BLOCKING from 6 inch splits. I get much more physical double teams, It's much tougher to blitz us, I have better inside gap protection, teaching pulling is easier shorter distances to cover, easier down blocks, wedge readiness, i can shutoff backside pursuit much easier,solid pass protection ,and I'm not wasting time on making sure there splits are accurate. Take into consideration inside foot back toe to heal and inside hand down I've given my least athletic guy a chance to be successful at all of the above. At 1st i was against it but know i see were i can take this thing. On the other hand if i was going one back pro were we'd have to zone step than at minimum i'd be at 18 only because stepping to play side i believe i can get kid's to cover more ground teaching what i would call a fire step. Know it's a little off topic but it's what i do sorry fellas......
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Offline IronmanFootball

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Re: TE or no TE in Prostyle
« Reply #44 on: May 30, 2016, 06:48:13 PM »
   Iron

I know how challenge it can be at a small private school. How many coaches do you have? When I was at LMP we only had 3. BTW LMP just named a new HC.

Joe


Coach- we only have 4 including me. QB, RB/LB, OL/DL, WR/DB (me)

I didn't know about LMP, no idea if that will make a difference. They were the only team we played all year in 2015 w/ less talent than us. It was close but the speed wasn't there.