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Author Topic: New onsides kick rule/results  (Read 7973 times)

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Offline budfos

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New onsides kick rule/results
« on: October 31, 2014, 09:26:01 AM »
For the first time ever my team recovered ZERO onsides kicks.   We are usually pretty good at it.  Part of the reason, is we weren't as "athletic" as we have been in the past and not quite as aggressive.  I think the overwhelming factor though was the new 5 yards behind the kickoff point rule.

We typically, use the hard hop on second bounce style of kick and the kicker was pretty good at it.  It wasn't always "placed" perfectly, but he was damn good at getting that hard bounce. 

Have others seen their recovery % drop this season?  We are an 8th grade team.

dlc


Offline Coach Kyle

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Re: New onsides kick rule/results
« Reply #1 on: October 31, 2014, 10:36:57 AM »
No, but our teams were never very good at it.

Offline patriotsfatboy1

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Re: New onsides kick rule/results
« Reply #2 on: October 31, 2014, 10:56:08 AM »
We did not do many onsides this season due to our schedule and scores of games.  However, we did work on it more than in the past with the guys who would be recovering and less on the kicker (because he was always fine).  We ended up with 3 or so in 10 games, but our overall recovery percentage was far better because we really only did about 8 or 9 all season. 

Our recovery still stinks though as we lost a couple of big ones in the playoffs.

Offline PSLCOACHROB

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Re: New onsides kick rule/results
« Reply #3 on: October 31, 2014, 12:37:15 PM »
We did not do many onsides this season due to our schedule and scores of games.  However, we did work on it more than in the past with the guys who would be recovering and less on the kicker (because he was always fine).  We ended up with 3 or so in 10 games, but our overall recovery percentage was far better because we really only did about 8 or 9 all season. 

Our recovery still stinks though as we lost a couple of big ones in the playoffs.
A little less but that is due to us spending less time on it this year due to other issues.

Offline Bob Goodman

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Re: New onsides kick rule/results
« Reply #4 on: November 01, 2014, 12:04:12 AM »
For the first time ever my team recovered ZERO onsides kicks.   We are usually pretty good at it.  Part of the reason, is we weren't as "athletic" as we have been in the past and not quite as aggressive.  I think the overwhelming factor though was the new 5 yards behind the kickoff point rule.
Really?  Your 14Us take more than 5 yards to get up to speed?

Offline budfos

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Re: New onsides kick rule/results
« Reply #5 on: November 01, 2014, 10:15:34 AM »
Really?  Your 14Us take more than 5 yards to get up to speed?

Yes they do and unless your 14u's are world class sprinters, i'm sure they do to.  I also mentioned that one of the issues imo was the fact that we weren't as athletic as years past. 

Offline Michael

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Re: New onsides kick rule/results
« Reply #6 on: November 01, 2014, 02:00:13 PM »
Bolt's 9.58:

0.15 reaction time
1.74
1.00
0.90
0.85
0.84
0.83
0.81
0.80
0.83
0.83

I think it's safe to say he didn't get "up to speed" in five yards.
“If you can't explain it to a six-year-old, you don't understand it yourself.” ― Albert Einstein

Offline Michael

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« Last Edit: November 01, 2014, 02:20:43 PM by Michael »
“If you can't explain it to a six-year-old, you don't understand it yourself.” ― Albert Einstein

Offline Bob Goodman

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Re: New onsides kick rule/results
« Reply #8 on: November 01, 2014, 02:19:30 PM »
Bolt's 9.58:

0.15 reaction time
1.74
1.00
0.90
0.85
0.84
0.83
0.81
0.80
0.83
0.83

I think it's safe to say he didn't get "up to speed" in five yards.
Interesting, says he takes 20 yds. to get up to speed.  But how is "reaction time" measured?  Is that from the gun to the first motion detected?  If so, then actually the 1st 10 yds. would be improved if he could be given a countdown, as the kicking team gets by starting together.  You can start getting up speed even when you've barely moved forward, as opposed to a sprinter who has to react to an untimed starter's gun.

And for 14Us, 5 yds. is a longer distance than for adults.

Quote
Not a lot of five-yard run-ups.
Sure, they're saving strength by taking a longer run-up.  But how much would they lose if they were confined to a smaller space?  Plus, competitors in some of those run-up contests don't even approach straight, but will turn toward their non-dominant foot.  Nothing says the players of the team kicking off can't do the same, taking a curling path to their restraining line, which would increase the distance they'd get to accelerate in.
« Last Edit: November 01, 2014, 02:28:00 PM by Bob Goodman »

Offline Michael

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Re: New onsides kick rule/results
« Reply #9 on: November 01, 2014, 02:27:06 PM »
It's gun to first pressure on the blocks.

The 1.74 is from first pressure on the blocks.  He was 1.89 from the gun to the 10-metre mark.

Any reaction time below 0.100 is a false start.

But he had a full running start into the second 10 meters, and every 10 meters until the 9th was still faster than the one before it.
“If you can't explain it to a six-year-old, you don't understand it yourself.” ― Albert Einstein

Offline Bob Goodman

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Re: New onsides kick rule/results
« Reply #10 on: November 01, 2014, 02:32:22 PM »
It's gun to first pressure on the blocks.

The 1.74 is from first pressure on the blocks.  He was 1.89 from the gun to the 10-metre mark.

Any reaction time below 0.100 is a false start.

But he had a full running start into the second 10 meters, and every 10 meters until the 9th was still faster than the one before it.
But by the 3rd 10m he's up to 92% of the speed he has in the last 10m before the tape.

Offline Michael

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Re: New onsides kick rule/results
« Reply #11 on: November 01, 2014, 02:37:41 PM »
But by the 3rd 10m he's up to 92% of the speed he has in the last 10m before the tape.

Yeah, but you're comparing the third 10 meters to a period of deceleration.  And even then, it's 92%, not 100%.

MYTH: BUSTED.
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Offline Bob Goodman

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Re: New onsides kick rule/results
« Reply #12 on: November 01, 2014, 02:53:29 PM »
Yeah, but you're comparing the third 10 meters to a period of deceleration.  And even then, it's 92%, not 100%.

MYTH: BUSTED.
What I'm looking for is how much effect it's going to have on onside kick execution with 14Us.  I can hardly believe limiting the distance they run up to within the 5 yard line behind their restraining line is that much of a handicap, especially considering that the youth players I see hardly ever took more than a 5 yard run-up anyway.  Those that did hardly ever went more than 10 yds., usually just 7 or so; many don't even take more than a 3 yard run-up.  Granted, most of those players were younger than the 13-14 YO class, but some were in it and some were on 16U or 18U teams.  So, budfos, from how far back were your players used to running up to their line?

Offline Coach Kyle

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Re: New onsides kick rule/results
« Reply #13 on: November 03, 2014, 09:48:39 AM »
What I'm looking for is how much effect it's going to have on onside kick execution with 14Us.  I can hardly believe limiting the distance they run up to within the 5 yard line behind their restraining line is that much of a handicap, especially considering that the youth players I see hardly ever took more than a 5 yard run-up anyway.  Those that did hardly ever went more than 10 yds., usually just 7 or so; many don't even take more than a 3 yard run-up.  Granted, most of those players were younger than the 13-14 YO class, but some were in it and some were on 16U or 18U teams.  So, budfos, from how far back were your players used to running up to their line?
It might be hard to believe, but one second makes a world of difference in a trap play. Why wouldn't it make a difference in an onside kick?

Offline budfos

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Re: New onsides kick rule/results
« Reply #14 on: November 03, 2014, 09:52:00 AM »
What I'm looking for is how much effect it's going to have on onside kick execution with 14Us.  I can hardly believe limiting the distance they run up to within the 5 yard line behind their restraining line is that much of a handicap, especially considering that the youth players I see hardly ever took more than a 5 yard run-up anyway.  Those that did hardly ever went more than 10 yds., usually just 7 or so; many don't even take more than a 3 yard run-up.  Granted, most of those players were younger than the 13-14 YO class, but some were in it and some were on 16U or 18U teams.  So, budfos, from how far back were your players used to running up to their line?

In years past, kicker at 4 1/2 -6 yards, others at 8-10 yards.   We also had more offsides issues with the kick this year in trying to make up for the shorter distance.  Just much less room for error from 5 yards back, so probably should have spent more practice time on it than we have in the past.