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Author Topic: Our evolution as an O  (Read 368 times)

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Offline Popcoach11

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Our evolution as an O
« on: October 30, 2017, 10:51:31 AM »
Couple things we’ve installed this year that we’ve gotten great mileage off of that we previously have never run in the past. We are strictly a 3x1 team.

1. 4 verticals. The lock seam and the bender has been like stealing vs certain looks we’ve seen. Also adding a couple tags to 4 verts for the lock seam and the bender has been good also. We’ve never been a vertical team, only taking shots every so often. Now this concept will be a mainstay for the future. Glad we installed it.

2. Bang 8 (call it what you wish). Again, as we’ve never been a vertical threat team, this route has developed into a great tool for us. Currently only throwing it to our single guy, but def can expand on that buy tagging others with this route. Definitely will be a staple for the future.

3. Getting the edge. Speed option to the right, and a crack toss to the left have got us on the edge well this year. We’ve always been a downhill team from spread, and have never ran any sweeps in the past (we’ve always just thrown bubble or now Screens) so being able get our back outside means Ds now truly have to defend most everyone out in space. Looking to expand on these for our future.

Couple things We plan on getting better at over this offseason

1. Getting our back in the passing game without breaking the structure of our formation. (Working on this currently as a playoff wrinkle)

2. Adding 1 concept that is good vs man and zone. So many to choose from, but one we currently don’t run that I believe we can install easily and can get mileage out of is curl/flat. My only hesitation is what route best fits our #3 receiver?

3. Getting my testicular fortitude stronger to call more QB runs.

Nothing revolutionary, just some things that we’ve never done before up until this year that we as an offensive staff that have been proven winners for us this year. Credit goes to my oldest son who flat out said “Dad stop being a douche bag, these are all proven on grass and if you need help, I’ll help you (with that sly smirk on his face)

The evolving and learning never stops.

Offline gumby_in_co

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Re: Our evolution as an O
« Reply #1 on: October 30, 2017, 06:22:53 PM »
The lock seam and the bender

Please explain.

Quote
Bang 8

Also please explain.

Quote
1. Getting our back in the passing game without breaking the structure of our formation. (Working on this currently as a playoff wrinkle)

We move our "Ace" around a lot, but when he's behind or next to the QB, we can't really throw to him (other than swings) without installing more verbiage. Having said that, we've played a few teams who like to send a FB or TB vertically through the LOS, then run an out/arrow. Very hard to pick up and something I'd like us to do. We just installed a pass to our H back lined up in the A or B gap that's deadly. It's part of our new ISO package.

Mission Statement: To create a Football Family that our players and parents can't imagine not being a part of.

Offline MHcoach

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Re: Our evolution as an O
« Reply #2 on: October 30, 2017, 06:56:12 PM »
Pop

Throwing the Post(Bang 8) has always been very good to us. Here are a couple things you can do to add to it.

Double 8's

You can do this from 2x2 or 3x1. Vs a 2 shell the QB reads the near safety he can't cover both.

POCO ( Post -Corner)

QB pumps the Bang 8 who sticks a foot in the ground & runs a corner.

Since I brought 4 Verts here it has really changed our offense. Most youth Coaches don't get that you need to throw it at 17-22 yds. They think you need to throw it 40 yds.

Joe
"Champions behave like champions before they're champions: they have a winning standard of performance before they are winners"
Bill Walsh

Offline morris

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Re: Our evolution as an O
« Reply #3 on: October 30, 2017, 09:53:03 PM »
How we run Curl Flat is what we call 851.
8:Bang 8
5: we push 7 steps and it it down/work it back down the stem
1: Flat route

It looks like Stick just deeper.

We’ve never been a big 4 verts team but we need to look into it. We run a lot of Snag. Btw some people run Curl Flat with number 3 on the corner route. We did a lot of RPO stuff this year which was good to us.

Offline Popcoach11

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Re: Our evolution as an O
« Reply #4 on: October 31, 2017, 03:37:48 AM »
Gumby.....bang 8 is a post route (ours is inside foot up, 7 steps), lock seam and bender refer to our #2 and #3 receivers routes in our version of 4 verticals...our #2 runs the lock seam which is just a straight vertical route (just draw a straight line from here to there and run straight) our #3 is our bender....he either splits a 2 deep shell or crosses face of a single high look (vs single high we have him aiming for opposite front pylon) so in a 3x1 set we teach #1, outside guy, mandatory outside release vertical, #2 middle guy, is our lock seam, #3 inside guy, is our bender. If we get zone we work #2 to #3, if we see Man, our QB picks best matchup between of our 2 outside guys.

MH....thanks for that. We installed double post tonight. Was $$$ vs zone....vs man not so much as we need to work on our stems.

Morris.....thinking of doing it just like that, as our inside guys are more possession type players and our outside guys are more speed guys. We see a lot of c3 and I believe this will kill .

BTW We played around with 5ft splits in spread today and my jaw just dropped.

Thanks guys
« Last Edit: October 31, 2017, 03:59:46 AM by Popcoach11 »

Offline CoachMattC

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Re: Our evolution as an O
« Reply #5 on: October 31, 2017, 08:19:00 AM »
Great post, sounds like you guys are having fun with this stuff. Makes me miss running this offense.

To emphasize what you asked about from 3x1 I'd be thinking about Stick (with either H/#3 or the tailback having the stick) and Stretch/Power. If you use an attached H I'd be thinking about Q counter.

Poco and Snag are terrific change ups on the single side from smoke/smoke and go. We shortened our Post to 5 steps and found it made all these routes blend together nicely.

Let us know how it goes.
« Last Edit: October 31, 2017, 12:21:26 PM by CoachMattC »
‎"Tell me and I forget. Teach me and I remember. Involve me and I learn." Benjamin Franklin

Offline Popcoach11

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Re: Our evolution as an O
« Reply #6 on: October 31, 2017, 09:05:51 AM »
Actually we do run our version of stick from 3x1 off bubble.

#1 on a vertical
#2 on a bubble
#3 runs the stick

That’s been good for us also when people are jumping out bubble screen.

This offense is fun as heck

Offline morris

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Re: Our evolution as an O
« Reply #7 on: October 31, 2017, 10:15:30 AM »
If you use motion this is a nice trick we use. We will motion a WR or RB out to be the farthest WR out and have them run a vertical. Number 2 from the sideline runs the Bang 8 (we use the same stem as you and line up 3 yards outside the hash). The space between the corner and safety in Cov 3 will be huge

Offline gumby_in_co

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Re: Our evolution as an O
« Reply #8 on: October 31, 2017, 01:11:29 PM »
Gumby.....bang 8 is a post route (ours is inside foot up, 7 steps), lock seam and bender refer to our #2 and #3 receivers routes in our version of 4 verticals...our #2 runs the lock seam which is just a straight vertical route (just draw a straight line from here to there and run straight) our #3 is our bender....he either splits a 2 deep shell or crosses face of a single high look (vs single high we have him aiming for opposite front pylon) so in a 3x1 set we teach #1, outside guy, mandatory outside release vertical, #2 middle guy, is our lock seam, #3 inside guy, is our bender. If we get zone we work #2 to #3, if we see Man, our QB picks best matchup between of our 2 outside guys.

Thanks Pop. We'd call that an 8 9 7 combo, but our 7 is a POCO. We installed 9 as an option fade. Normally an outside fade, but in the Spring, we faced some teams that played outside leverage on our #1, so we gave the option to run more of a vertical seam, fading slightly to the inside, then vertical. Haven't seen that in the Fall.

Quote
BTW We played around with 5ft splits in spread today and my jaw just dropped.

It's okay if you puckered a little bit. It took me the better part of a season to get used to it.

Mission Statement: To create a Football Family that our players and parents can't imagine not being a part of.

Offline somecoach

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Re: Our evolution as an O
« Reply #9 on: October 31, 2017, 08:41:45 PM »
Great Stuff Coach!

Many coaches (my self included at first) underestimate how easy it is to get 4 verts to work.

as for getting the back in the passing game, just watch out for heavy blitzing teams. He can do a lot of damage but if they send 6 against your 5 the qb can be open for some (unnecessary) hits.

Curl/Flat is very underrated imo, I wish I installed some form of it earlier in the year.
as for #3's route you could just send him vertical on the locked seam/ bender. less teaching and clears out the saftey.

Qb runs comes down to the kid.
Some guys CANT get tackled, some can, as long as you avoid him getting HIT (hard) Qb runs can be a headache for the defense.

Offline Popcoach11

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Re: Our evolution as an O
« Reply #10 on: November 01, 2017, 11:09:09 AM »
So we installed double post running it to our trips side with a dig under it. 1 post, 2 dig, 3 post, and it looked good.

Wanna make sure I’m coaching it correctly. Vs c3 we taught read FS. If he stays middle of field, hit #1, if he rolls over to our trips side, hit #3 who’s crossing FS face....both routes are exactly the same....7 steps break at 45 degrees.

Vs c2 any type of zone, we are teaching QB to stare at #1 and come back to #3 who’s adjusted his route to a skinny post splitting both safeties, if that’s cloudy, find the dig by #2.

Vs any single man we check to our single guy. No one can guard him, he’s been quadruple teamed at times this year.

Am I getting the most mileage out of this concept with how we’re teaching it?

Offline Popcoach11

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Re: Our evolution as an O
« Reply #11 on: November 12, 2017, 07:17:50 AM »
Double post was wide open vs c2 all three times we ran it yesterday and we couldn’t hit the side of a barn. 3 missed big play opportunities.....it’s definitely a slam dunk from 3x1

Gotta coach em up

Offline MHcoach

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Re: Our evolution as an O
« Reply #12 on: November 12, 2017, 09:31:21 AM »
P

What becomes important on throwing double Posts is the amount of air the QB puts on the ball. Throwing to #1 he wants as flat a ball as possible, to the inside Post enough air under the ball to allow the receiver to run under it. It sounds like a small difference but the devil is in the details.

We use landmarks, I dont know if you can because of the fields you play on. We tell our QB throw #1 to the hash mark & the Inside post to an upright.

Hope that helps.

Joe
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Bill Walsh

Offline Popcoach11

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Re: Our evolution as an O
« Reply #13 on: November 12, 2017, 03:18:56 PM »
Thanks joe.

I️ said couldn’t hit the side of a barn, I’m just really critical of my QB. It was more like right off the receivers fingertips. All 3 times we ran it, he threw to our #3 guy in trips who was running more of a skinny, threw 3 beautiful balls just out of his reach. We were just off a bit....all 3 would’ve been TDs had we connected because their 2 high shell was really wide.....I’m talking 5 yds outside each hash. We time our posts up with our recievers taking 7 steps with inside foot up and our QB is is taking 2 steps from the gun....if it’s there, bangin as soon as his 2nd step hits the ground...if it’s cloudy, hitch up and look for the dig.

Offline MHcoach

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Re: Our evolution as an O
« Reply #14 on: November 12, 2017, 05:04:13 PM »
Pop

We take a short 3 from the Gun & the timing is just right. We rip it on the third step. That evens to a 5 step drop from UTC. The first step is big then 2 hitch steps. The ball is up on 2 & out on 3.

Joe
"Champions behave like champions before they're champions: they have a winning standard of performance before they are winners"
Bill Walsh