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Author Topic: Coaches not seeing eye to eye?  (Read 747 times)

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Offline jm1827

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Coaches not seeing eye to eye?
« on: July 20, 2017, 12:42:36 PM »
Had my first incident f coaches not seeing eye to eye.  Been coaching youth football for 9 years, HC for 4.

Brought 2 assistants together for the first time, one I coached with 2 years ago and the other I coached with last year, but it was their first time coaching together.

Coach #1 has coached youth for maybe 12 years, coached his older son now coaching his younger son, he is our OC.  He knows some of the fundamentals and has been successful in the past, players and parents love him and kids really respond to him.

Coach #2 joined us last year, was maybe his 3rd year coaching youth, but he coached HS level for 25+ years.  Was very successful and very well respected.  Obviously he brought a tremendous amount of knowledge and was a great asset last season.  I learned more from him in 1 year than i probably did over the past 8 years.

We start installing the offense and coach #1 (youth coach) wouldn't listen to anything me or coach #2 (HS coach) had to say.  I went over the blocking for a basic power, with the backside G pulling and FB kicking out he went on to tell me that you can't pull the back side G.  We installed it and it worked fine (as it has for me over the past 7 years), while installing it I hear this coach telling the RBs- "hit the hole as fast as you can I want to prove these guys wrong, that you can't pull on this".

Next coach #2 (HS) asks what the WB is doing on the play standing next to the play side TE and coach #1 says- standing there, coach #2 explains that if he stands there you will draw another defender in the box, and recommends splitting him out.  At this coach #1 goes ballistic, questioning the other coaches credentials, accusing him of second guessing everything he does and walks over and gets in his face and continues yelling and screaming.

I stepped in the middle and diffused it.  During this entire ordeal, the former HS coach kept his cool, tried to explain why he was suggesting what he did, offered to talk to the other coach and then let me know that he would do whatever I suggested since I was the HC.

My guess is coach #2 (youth) felt threatened by the other coach and was looking for something to get defensive over.  Just looking for any feedback and or recommendations from others who have experienced this.

Thanks

Offline Michael

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Re: Coaches not seeing eye to eye?
« Reply #1 on: July 20, 2017, 12:51:06 PM »
I never (or almost never) speculate on what people are thinking.  If I think it will do any good, I ask them.  Otherwise, I just go by actions.  And the actions of the youth dude mean he needs to go.  You can try to put a band-aid on all this, but the band-aid will never stay on.  Just tell him he needs to find an opportunity on a team where he doesn't have someone who will be so annoying for him to work with.

By the way, if he'd been coaching for me, it never would have gotten to this point, because he would have been gone before he finished the sentence that included "I want to prove these guys wrong."
“If you can't explain it to a six-year-old, you don't understand it yourself.” ― Albert Einstein

Offline Shaggyd99

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Re: Coaches not seeing eye to eye?
« Reply #2 on: July 20, 2017, 12:59:59 PM »
Dear Coach #1,
We no longer need your assistance.  Thank you

Offline Beansko82

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Re: Coaches not seeing eye to eye?
« Reply #3 on: July 20, 2017, 01:15:37 PM »
Seems like a no brainer, tell #1 to kick rocks.  You can't expect everyone to get along all the time but you can and should expect them to resolve it like a grownup.  The fact that he was actively trying to make your plays fail should tell you everything you need to know about him.  Sooner you let him go the better.

Offline Dusty Ol Fart

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Re: Coaches not seeing eye to eye?
« Reply #4 on: July 20, 2017, 01:48:32 PM »
Its one thing not seeing eye to eye in a meeting.  It's completely another loose your cool and get confrontational in front of the kids.

He has made it clear who HE thinks the Boss is.  Now its your turn/duty to Send The Right Message with a Pink Slip.

You will understandably loose a player as well. 

 
 
Not MPP... ONE TASK!  Teach them!  :)

Offline cd

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Re: Coaches not seeing eye to eye?
« Reply #5 on: July 20, 2017, 01:59:51 PM »
Was he "having a bad day" or does he make a habit of this sort of thing?

Since coaches do not grow on trees (neither do friends for that matter) if this was a one time thing I'd sit down with him and let him know this is unacceptable.  However he this is how he usually acts than you should have gotten rid of him long ago.

Offline gumby_in_co

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Re: Coaches not seeing eye to eye?
« Reply #6 on: July 20, 2017, 02:13:43 PM »
JM,

Welcome to the Forum. Heck of a first post, BTW. I think you knew the answer to your question before you asked it. You can play the "what if" game . . . "what if he was just having a bad day and this will never happen again?" Your guess is better than anyone's because you know the guy. If you're going to guess wrong, guess in the direction that guarantees you won't have a disruptive cancer on your staff. A sense of family, sacrifice and selflessness is the most important part of a successful football team. This guy doesn't get that and perhaps never will. Kids will pick up on that. Then, around October, you'll be posting about your team where the parts seem to be working on O and D, but the wheels fall off the wagon at the first sign of adversity.

On a different note, I'm not very familiar with the "5-2". Got any written materials on it, or can you describe it in a paragraph or two? Always like to hear about different defenses. Start a new post in "General Defense" if you're game.
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Offline mahonz

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Re: Coaches not seeing eye to eye?
« Reply #7 on: July 20, 2017, 03:14:04 PM »
He owes the Team an apology before he gets back too work....coaches and players.

If he refuses then he must resign.

Had it been just between you coaches....workable...he involved the kids directly.....unacceptable.
Collect moments, not wins.

Offline fizzlife

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Re: Coaches not seeing eye to eye?
« Reply #8 on: July 20, 2017, 03:16:59 PM »
Had my first incident f coaches not seeing eye to eye.  Been coaching youth football for 9 years, HC for 4.

Brought 2 assistants together for the first time, one I coached with 2 years ago and the other I coached with last year, but it was their first time coaching together.

Coach #1 has coached youth for maybe 12 years, coached his older son now coaching his younger son, he is our OC.  He knows some of the fundamentals and has been successful in the past, players and parents love him and kids really respond to him.

Coach #2 joined us last year, was maybe his 3rd year coaching youth, but he coached HS level for 25+ years.  Was very successful and very well respected.  Obviously he brought a tremendous amount of knowledge and was a great asset last season.  I learned more from him in 1 year than i probably did over the past 8 years.

We start installing the offense and coach #1 (youth coach) wouldn't listen to anything me or coach #2 (HS coach) had to say.  I went over the blocking for a basic power, with the backside G pulling and FB kicking out he went on to tell me that you can't pull the back side G.  We installed it and it worked fine (as it has for me over the past 7 years), while installing it I hear this coach telling the RBs- "hit the hole as fast as you can I want to prove these guys wrong, that you can't pull on this".

Next coach #2 (HS) asks what the WB is doing on the play standing next to the play side TE and coach #1 says- standing there, coach #2 explains that if he stands there you will draw another defender in the box, and recommends splitting him out.  At this coach #1 goes ballistic, questioning the other coaches credentials, accusing him of second guessing everything he does and walks over and gets in his face and continues yelling and screaming.

I stepped in the middle and diffused it.  During this entire ordeal, the former HS coach kept his cool, tried to explain why he was suggesting what he did, offered to talk to the other coach and then let me know that he would do whatever I suggested since I was the HC.

My guess is coach #2 (youth) felt threatened by the other coach and was looking for something to get defensive over.  Just looking for any feedback and or recommendations from others who have experienced this.

Thanks

Just a suggestion. All this could have been resolved before stepping on the field. Off season coaches meetings. Now, that's not saying coach #1 wouldn't still find something to get upset about.
Dave

Whatever the situation, offering apparently well-reasoned excuses and plausible alibis to explain your failings is simply irresponsible. --Bill Walsh,  Finding The Winning Edge

Offline Dusty Ol Fart

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Re: Coaches not seeing eye to eye?
« Reply #9 on: July 20, 2017, 03:29:24 PM »
Was he "having a bad day" or does he make a habit of this sort of thing?

Since coaches do not grow on trees (neither do friends for that matter) if this was a one time thing I'd sit down with him and let him know this is unacceptable.  However he this is how he usually acts than you should have gotten rid of him long ago.

Coaches are scarce however, it does not mean you allow episodes like this for that reason.  Have had a some experience with Coaches who pushed the envelope in other ways as well and got away with it.  When the last straw was snapped they attempted to turn themselves into Martyr's.  Its never fun or satisfying to dismiss someone who volunteers their time.  There is some merit to second chances and equal merit to "Give em an inch and they'll take a mile".   
Not MPP... ONE TASK!  Teach them!  :)

Offline PSLCOACHROB

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Re: Coaches not seeing eye to eye?
« Reply #10 on: July 20, 2017, 04:30:56 PM »
I was lucky and coached much of my time under an extremely well respected header and we won alot, and I mean a shit ton of games. We didn't see eye to eye all the time. Sometimes my way won out but most of the time his way won out. That had to do with three things. First, he was the header damn it. Second, most of the time his way was just better. With more knowledge and experience than me he just knew better. Thirdly, I respected the man to know my place and to understand the situation. But never did our disagreements(and they were never more than a disagreement, just talk it out and get it fixed) bleed over into an area that the team could witness. That is just unacceptable. Not even once from either side.

The problem I have with people saying well maybe he was having a bad day is that it doesn't matter because he was flat out wrong in his understanding of the scheme. Power is not power without the bsg pull. It gets into a blast type play. Doable and a good play but it aint power. I walked into practice all the time affter having a bad day and football brightened it up and turned the day around usually. Crap, if being out there isn't fun then what are you doing?

I do have to disagree with the hs coach on one thing though and that is the wing. You can run power with a wing. In fact wing offenses often base out of power. But that is based on your scheme and maybe what you are doing it is better to split him out. Leaving him attached usually has his block be first backer inside. But you can just as easily split him and move the defense out. Maybe. Doesn't always work.

Don't ask for an apology. Don't give him a second chance. Fire him. Just imagine how he reacts in a game when things start to go wrong. He has no respect for you or the hs coach, is insecure and really doesn't know crap about football or more importantly, coaching. Fire him now. Give me his number. I'll do it. Guy us a team wrecker.

Offline vikingdw

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Re: Coaches not seeing eye to eye?
« Reply #11 on: July 20, 2017, 04:36:38 PM »
Goodbye Coach #1...

Offline MHcoach

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Re: Coaches not seeing eye to eye?
« Reply #12 on: July 20, 2017, 05:10:02 PM »
First rule, coaches never argue on the field.

Second rule, the HC is always right even when he wrong.

We never disagree in front of the players, nor would we ever pit players against coaches. That is the sort of thing that is petty & stupid. My advice is correct the situation, after a discussion it can never happen again.

Joe
"Champions behave like champions before they're champions: they have a winning standard of performance before they are winners"
Bill Walsh

Offline gumby_in_co

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Re: Coaches not seeing eye to eye?
« Reply #13 on: July 21, 2017, 11:38:44 AM »
Fire him now. Give me his number. I'll do it.

  :D :D :D :D :D :D :D

Funniest thing I've read on here in awhile.
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Offline jm1827

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Re: Coaches not seeing eye to eye?
« Reply #14 on: July 24, 2017, 04:17:11 PM »
Hi Everyone,

Thanks for the advice and very useful input, lots of great info. 

Had a "discussion" with both coaches as well as all of the other coaches that were present.  Let everyone know in no uncertain terms that this was unacceptable and will not happen again.  I called a coaches meeting for tonight but I already I let them know that they can resolve this immediately, apologize to the boys, and move forward or they can step down as coaches. And if anything even remotely resembling this happens again they will be gone.  Had to reiterate how coaching is a privilege not a right.

And my apologies about  the first post, I have been lurking so long here I felt like I had posted already, but obviously have not.